13:31:16 to roll.

13:31:19 >> So is there a signal that

tells us we are live?

13:31:23 >> I just started recording.

>> We are recording.

>>

13:31:26 Okay.

>> Up in the left-hand corner

you should see a

13:31:30 "recording" red

dot.

>> It didn't go on for me.

>> Oh, I see

13:31:33 a red flashing

bottom line.

13:31:40 Yeah.

>> So good afternoon.

This is design commission

13:31:44 for

Thursday, may

13:31:47 14th, 2020.

Please note that the commission

hearings

13:31:51 room at 1,900 southwest

4th Avenue,

13:31:55 2,500 B is closed

to the public due to

13:31:58 the

Covid-19 pandemic.

13:32:01 We are meeting via

13:32:04 zoom for the

very first time today.

13:32:07 Under Portland city code and

state law the design commission

13:32:10

so holding this meeting

electronically.

All members of the commission

are

13:32:13 attending remotely by video

and

13:32:16 tele-conference.

Through required public notice

the public is invited to also

13:32:19

participate remotely and can

provide testimony during today's

hearing.

13:32:24 the commission is doing this as

a result of the Covid-19

pandemic and the

13:32:27 need to limit

in-person

13:32:31 contact and social

distances.

This is an emergency that

threatens

13:32:33 the public health,

safety, and welfare which

requires us to meet

13:32:37 remotely by

electronics communications.

Thanks to everyone for

13:32:40 their

patience, their flexibility, and

13:32:43

understanding as we manage

through this

13:32:47 difficult situation

to do our business.

As we usually

13:32:50 do, we will begin

our hearing today with

13:32:56

introductions.

First the bureau of development

staff and then Commissioners

13:32:58 who

are present, and just to be sure

that we are well organized about

13:33:04

this, I propose that each person

13:33:07

introduce themselves, state

their position and call on the

next

13:33:11 person.

So we are going to pass the

13:33:14

baton.

We will begin with senior

13:33:17

planner Tim Heron.

>> Great.

Thank you, Commissioner.

This

13:33:20 is Tim Heron, senior

planner, bureau of development

13:33:23

services.

It is a pleasure to start the

13:33:26 first virtual design commission

13:33:30

Webinar hearing the City of

Portland has ever

13:33:34 seen.

I will turn my mic off so you

don't hear the other things

going on in

13:33:37 my home.

I will pass the

13:33:41 baton to Kara

Fioravanti.

13:33:46 >> Thank you, Tim Heron.

This is Kara

13:33:50 Fioravanti.

The planner of the design review

and historic review

13:33:53 team.

I will pass the

13:33:57 baton to

13:34:00 Don

Vallaster.

>> Oh, that was quick.

This is Don

13:34:04 Vallaster,

Commissioner on the design

13:34:07

commission, and I will pass it

onto Commissioner

13:34:10 Rodriguez.

>> This is Sam Rodriguez,

13:34:13 also

the design review Commissioner,

and I will pass

13:34:16 it onto Zari.

>> Zari

13:34:19 Santner, Commissioner,

and I pass it

13:34:22 onto Shandra

Robinson.

>> I am Shandra

13:34:26 Robinson, and I

am also a design Commissioner,

and I will pass it

13:34:29 onto

Commissioner

13:34:33 Molinar.

>> Jessica Molinar, design

Commissioner, and I will pass

13:34:37 it

onto Commissioner McCarter.

>> Commissioner

13:34:40 McCarter, Brian

McCarter of the Portland design

commission, and I will pass

13:34:43 it

back to chairman

13:34:48 Livingston.

>> This is [inaudible]

Livingston, Portland design

Commissioner, and chair of the

13:34:51

design commission, and I am

going to circle back around to

be sure

13:34:54 that

13:34:57 we a few members of

staff who are also with us

13:35:00 today

beginning with the clerk Laura

13:35:05

DuVall.

>> Hi, I'm Laura DuVall, the

hearings

13:35:11 clerk.

>> And Bryan Tierney.

>> Hello, this is Bryan

13:35:16 Tierney,

hearings clerk.

>> Thank you very

13:35:19 much.

And there are a handful of

planners with us, today,

13:35:22 first

Grace Jeffreys.

13:35:28 >> Sorry, took me a minute to

unmute.

Good afternoon.

It's

13:35:31 great to see all of

13:35:34 you.

>> Thanks for joining us,

grace.

13:35:38 Stacy Monroe.

>> Good afternoon, commission,

nice to see you, as

13:35:45 well.

>> And Sam

13:35:50 Nelsen.

>> Good afternoon,

commissioners.

It's good to see everyone.

13:35:54 >> Okay.

I think that we have captured

13:35:57

all staff, all commissioners.

If there is someone who

13:36:01 is not

had the opportunity to introduce

themselves, for the

13:36:04 record,

please raise

13:36:07 your hand on the

participants list, and we will

circle back around, and

13:36:10 just to

be sure, we will be monitoring

the

13:36:13 participants' list,

13:36:18 so at

any time we may interject.

13:36:21 In fact, the interjections

13:36:24 could

come from Laura, Bryan,

13:36:28 or maybe

even

13:36:32 me.

So commission members, private

citizens, appointed by the Mayor

13:36:35

to provide review of new

construction or remodeling of

13:36:38

the projects within the design

zone.

They are not

13:36:42 paid.

It is entirely a volunteer.

More detailed information

regarding the

13:36:45 purpose and

function of the commission can

be found in the Portland zoning

13:36:50

code.

Commission members must declare

a conflict of

13:36:53 interest, bias or

ex parte contact prior to the

13:36:56

staff presentation.

If a commission member has a

conflict of

13:36:59 interest or bias,

you are not allowed to

participate in the commission

13:37:03

discussions or voting on that

project.

If a commission member has

13:37:06 had

an ex parte contact, they must

declare the

13:37:09 substance on the

record, and it is subject to

13:37:13

rebuttal.

So we have is a fairly light

agenda today.

I

13:37:16 believe that the only item on

our agenda is items of

13:37:19 interest,

so I am going to

13:37:22 bypass the

readings we might have for the

13:37:25

typical land use reviews, and

any type of

13:37:29 appeal or other case

that might land in front of the

13:37:32

commission.

At this point, I think that I

will turn it over to Tim

13:37:36 Heron

to walk us through items of

13:37:39

interest.

>> Awesome.

Great.

Most

13:37:42 exciting items of interest

I have ever had the pleasure

13:37:45 of

telling you all

13:37:49 about.

I am going to start with just a

couple of things.

13:37:52 I wanted to acknowledge Darren

13:37:56

Wegener, who is also here with

us --

13:37:59 at least he was a moment

ago.

I think he may have stepped

13:38:02 out

for another meeting, so I missed

the opportunity to say

13:38:06 hi.

Darren has been one of the key

people behind the

13:38:09 scenes helping

us get our tech up and

13:38:13 running.

I will circle back and talk with

him.

He will be present for the next

hearings, which we

13:38:16 have next

week on the 21st, which will

be a

13:38:20 bit more robust than today

with a

13:38:23 little more technical

gymnastics that we

13:38:26 may need

assistance with, but we

13:38:30 hope

that he's our training wheels,

if you will so after

13:38:34 a couple

hearings we hope to take those

off, and we will be full scheme

13:38:38

ahead.

I wanted to start first by

13:38:41

acknowledging Laura and Bryan

Tierney, our

13:38:45 clerks behind the

scenes.

It's a new

13:38:48 day doing virtual

hearings for the clerks.

Their job

13:38:51 already is challenging

moving the paper

13:38:54 and stuffing

the stuff and all the things

that you

13:38:57 already know, but the

last about a

13:39:01 month and a half

preparing for virtual hearings

has

13:39:04 been a completely new

13:39:07 animal

of tech

13:39:12 management, prehearing

management, naming conventions

for

13:39:15 how we can see panelists and

see

13:39:19 attendees.

I could go

13:39:23 on.

When I heard of zoom, it was

something that I thought my

13:39:26 dog

did when she got really excited

and ran around the room

13:39:29 really

fast.

That's how

13:39:32 that might date me a

bit, but a lot of staff had to

step up

13:39:35 and really move us into

this forum, just like all

13:39:38 of you

all.

I want to acknowledge them and I

also want

13:39:42 to acknowledge all of

the staff for the design

commission

13:39:45 and the historic

landmarks commission.

The landmarks commission

13:39:48 had a

fantastic first hearing on

13:39:52

Monday.

Curiously enough it went longer

than we

13:39:56 planned.

Some of that, I think, frankly

had something to do with

13:39:59 it.

It was nice to see everyone's

faces.

So it was a little

13:40:02 social.

It was fun.

We got business done.

It was

13:40:05 great.

Hillary did a fantastic job as a

liaison for

13:40:09 that.

All of us doing it from our

different personal

13:40:12 spaces at

home.

So it's been quite a

13:40:15 journey, so

it's really nice to be here.

And great to

13:40:18 see your faces.

>> You,

13:40:22 too.

>> I have -- I am going

13:40:25 to hit

-- title all six things, and

then I will roll through

13:40:28 them.

There is six items of interest.

One is

13:40:32 the future.

We will talk about that.

Two is our

13:40:35 agenda ahead.

Looking into the summer.

Three is

13:40:38 going to be a quick

update on the agenda from

13:40:44 Staci

I see Laura is attending, as

well.

She may participate with that,

and

13:40:47 frankly, just questions,

wrap-up

13:40:51 , and the Commissioner

and I talked before the hearing

started about potentially

13:40:54

inviting our attendees if they

would like to

13:40:57 help test our

systems so to

13:41:01 speak.

It would be nice to do that,

unless -- in

13:41:03 a less formal

setting and to that degree, and

then I

13:41:06 would like to end with a

13:41:09

Commissioner zoom meeting screen

13:41:13

shot.

Kind of ask you all to say

13:41:17

"cheese," because this is pretty

momentous, and I ask first

because I

13:41:20 want to give you a

chance to

13:41:26 smile.

[Laughter]

Then I will sneak a screen shot

while you are not looking,

13:41:29 so I

think that would be an enjoyable

way to maybe end

13:41:32 the hearing

today.

So those are the items.

I will

13:41:35 start with the future.

Virtual

13:41:38 hearings are our

future.

Some day I hope

13:41:41 that we get back

into

13:41:45 the 2500-a and inhabit the

same space

13:41:48 safely, but we don't

know when that's going to be

right now, as

13:41:51 you all know.

What I do know

13:41:54 is already the

virtual hearing format we are

doing right

13:41:58 now allows access to

us by the public in a

13:42:01 way that

we have never been available

before.

13:42:06 Obviously, it presumes internet

access for certain, but the

ability

13:42:09 for someone to not have

to drive downtown, park, pay for

13:42:12

parking, get to a hearing

on-time and testify is

13:42:15 vastly

easier with a mobile phone or a

laptop computer

13:42:18 through this

setting, so I think that it's

13:42:23

fantastic.

It raises all kinds of new

challenges for us, like I

13:42:26

mentioned, with the effort on

Laura and Bryan's part,

13:42:29 setting

these things up, but I think we

will get that figured out.

We are going to

13:42:32 have hiccups.

We are going to have trips.

We are going to work

13:42:36 it out, and

in part because we

13:42:39 have to.

If it works out as well as I

hope and

13:42:42 what I have been seeing

with my own experience with

13:42:45 zoom

meetings is I am finding some of

these forums -- this

13:42:49 forum

actually helps with efficiency.

13:42:52 So I am very optimistic that you

are going to

13:42:55 see estimated times

for our hearings go down because

I think that we are

13:42:58 going to get

better at how we do this.

I think

13:43:01 the format, itself,

lends itself to an

13:43:05 efficiency.

But, to that point, I want

13:43:08 to

acknowledge something known as

zoom fatigue, and that

13:43:11 is really

more about not so many zoom,

13:43:14 but

it's about this way of

communicating and

13:43:18 having so many

-- so much visual stimulus

through your

13:43:21 screen can be

draining.

We are being very

13:43:24 mindful in

scheduling hearings and

specifically, because of

13:43:27 that

issue, so what we will

13:43:31 do moving

forward is the next -- this is

the next topic

13:43:34 -- is work on, as

we have always tried to

13:43:37 do, is

shorter hearings but potentially

13:43:40

more days so there is a way that

we will talk to you all about

13:43:44

that and I hope that's something

that might work for you given

you are not

13:43:47 commuting into the

city.

You are also not parking or

moving

13:43:50 around and spending that

time getting to the hearing

room.

So that's something

13:43:53 that we will

venture on together.

Right now my

13:43:57 commute is just

down one flight of stairs to the

13:44:00 basement.

I miss my bike ride into work,

but

13:44:03 man, I have never been at

work faster, so it's

13:44:07 an

interesting time for me, too.

When it comes to

13:44:11 timing, we

don't know.

We are really following the lead

from the

13:44:16 Governor, Kate Brown in

terms of how we

13:44:19 reopen, how

social distancing is going to

work.

We, obviously, live in

13:44:22 a city.

We hold hearings in a

13:44:25 room.

I know we just paid for the

dioce we have, and you

13:44:28 are not

six feet apart, and I don't

think we are getting another

13:44:31

one.

So I think that it's going to be

some time before we see that

13:44:35

room again.

Once, obviously, once the

Governor

13:44:38 makes an announcement,

we will follow the lead of

13:44:42 the

Mayor, Ted

13:44:45 wheeler, and our BDS

13:44:48 director's lead and move forward

on how we get back together.

I think, though,

13:44:51 it's just an

affirmation that we are doing

this for a

13:44:55 while.

So as you get more comfortable

with

13:44:58 the technology, and how you

receive the materials and

reviewing

13:45:01 them, we are really

looking for your feedback.

Like what's working.

What's

13:45:05 not working.

What do you need?

What's

13:45:08 missing?

And we are going to do

everything that we can to

13:45:11 make

that smoother, cleaner, and the

best that we can

13:45:14 do.

So you have seen that already in

the guides that we sent

13:45:18 out.

Those will, no doubt, be

updated.

I,

13:45:21 actually, have a couple more

updates that we'll do with

13:45:25

those, and I will send that

out.

I will try and use

13:45:28 a convention,

and hillary will be doing the

13:45:31

same with the Landmarks

Commission when there

13:45:34 is an

update.

I will try to make a red print

13:45:37

13:45:40 or yellow board of the

document like

13:45:44 okay, version may

13:45:47

14th, 2020 has this update,

and it may be something like

13:45:50

Commissioner McCarter has the

coolest architectural features

in his

13:45:54 backgrounds, so I am

going to add that to

13:45:57 the

preference.

Or Tim's flag behind him needs

to

13:46:00 change every week, you know.

13:46:03 [Laughter]

Kidding, but I think that that's

something that the more we get

13:46:06

familiar, the cleaner the

hearings are going to run and

13:46:09

the faster we are going to move

forward.

So that's

13:46:13 my future in my mind

and how we talked about it

13:46:16

internally.

Does anyone have any

13:46:20 questions

about the

13:46:24 future?

>> I just have a thought.

Based on

13:46:28 hillary's experience

that she says

13:46:31 after two hours

she was totally exhausted.

I

13:46:34 am wondering if we shouldn't

be responding more in

13:46:37 print than

forwarding those comments on so

that the

13:46:40 hearing would just be

sort of a follow-up on the

thoughts we already

13:46:43 put forth

rather than do

13:46:47 it all in the

meeting

13:46:51 format.

>> A great question.

I think it is a public hearing,

so I think

13:46:54 it's really going to

be important that the public

hear

13:46:58 your words as well as see

you.

How

13:47:01 you prepare for the hearing,

however, could be doubling

13:47:04 down

on that, so for instance

13:47:09 having

notes prepared that you also

forward

13:47:12 is fine, but also even

if you are rereading them or

13:47:16

presenting them, I think that's

going to be an important part of

what we do

13:47:19 as commissioners so

that everyone here hears your

13:47:22

thoughts and words, and we get

into hearings and we start to

compare notes and put

13:47:26 them

together and do that thing we

call

13:47:29 "deliberation," that we are

all kind of contributing and

riffing off of each

13:47:33 other.

It's going to be a little

different because we are all,

you

13:47:37 know, tiles on a computer

screen, you

13:47:40 know, so there is

the nuance there.

I am relying on myself,

13:47:43 your

words and what I hear, but I am

also relying

13:47:46 on what I see in

your

13:47:51 expressions.

I know some commissioners more

than others can read my

13:47:55 facial

expressions pretty well in the

hearing

13:47:58 room, so I will share

those as much as I

13:48:01 can.

Although, if you want I am fine

and I can just

13:48:04 do this all the

time if that's

13:48:07 more helpful, but

I know that

13:48:10 Commissioner Jessica

always sat a few chairs to my

right and really appreciated

some

13:48:14 of my expressions, so I

will probably be

13:48:17 mindful it's

not just her viewing them these

13:48:20

days.

Sorry, Jessica.

I might be more

13:48:25 filtered.

>> I want to respond to Don's

suggestion.

I

13:48:28 find it very useful

13:48:31 to write

things, but one thing

13:48:34 that I

really miss in terms of

13:48:37 the DAR

that we already

13:48:40 submitted is

that in the meetings listening

to each

13:48:44 of us we learn from each

other quite a bit.

Not all of us

13:48:47 have the same kind

of

13:48:51 expertise, so I felt that was

really

13:48:54 missing.

I didn't know how this

13:48:57 was going

to be communicated

13:49:01 through the

applicant,

13:49:04 to what extent we

felt strongly about the opinion

that we

13:49:08 were raising, which

could be

13:49:11 moderated by listening

to each other.

So I

13:49:15 think that we may have to

modify a lot

13:49:18 of things as we go

13:49:22

along.

>> From my standpoint I think

13:49:25 on

some of these fairly

straightforward

13:49:28 projects, I

didn't spend a lot of time

pre-meeting going

13:49:31 over in great

detail because we pick up a lot

of

13:49:34 that during the

13:49:38

presentation.

So but I think in this format I

am going to have to

13:49:41 prepare more

for the meetings than I have in

the

13:49:46 past.

I think that it's just going to

be easier

13:49:49 to communicate on the

basis of more familiarity with

the

13:49:53 product than we have had to

have up to

13:49:56 now.

I kind of prefer the actual

13:49:59

meetings we have had

significantly, but we

13:50:02 are not in

that place at this time, so we

will have to

13:50:05 deal with this.

>> Maybe it's something that we

revisit down

13:50:09 the road if we are

finding the deliberation is --

the what

13:50:12 can of deliberation is

13:50:16

really leaving -- not a

congealed sort of

13:50:21 design

commission direction for the

applicants.

Maybe we

13:50:25 revisit that we do

something like this, do a zoom

13:50:28

meeting to do DARs down the

13:50:31

road.

I don't know.

I also like the

13:50:36 deliberation

because, you know, inevitably

Julie knows the

13:50:40 code better, or

Jessica knows the code better.

It's

13:50:43 just really good to have

colleagues remind us

13:50:48 of stuff.

While that's fine, but here's

what

13:50:51 the code says, you

13:50:55 know.

>> That's when the magic

happens.

It's the

13:50:58 deliberation.

For me, personally, that's the

part that it's a pleasure to be

paid to

13:51:01 be in the room to watch

you

13:51:04 deliberate.

So I know that we can repeat

that in

13:51:07 this virtual format.

13:51:11 Maybe that's a big, strong

push.

I know I have spoken

13:51:14 with Kara

and

13:51:17 other staff, I think that's

where a lot can happen.

I also see opportunities in

13:51:20 the

virtual format moving forward

that we have that as

13:51:23 an assist

in our hearings.

I could see a scenario,

13:51:26 bryans,

Bryan,

13:51:29 where the next time you

can leave the country, and if

you were willing you

13:51:35 could zoom

a

13:51:38 meeting, and we could get you

anywhere around the world now,

and we could set you

13:51:41 a monitor,

and you would be there.

Your

13:51:44 energy and physicality

would be missed, but it would

13:51:48 be

almost as good.

>> I will say this,

13:51:52 though, that

also the flip side is

13:51:55 having the

-- for the last DAR that we did,

13:51:58

having the discipline of filling

out the matrix is very good for

13:52:02

you.

It's a good exercise.

It forces you

13:52:05 to flip back and

forth between the drawings

13:52:09 and

really, you know, kind of get

your thoughts organized

13:52:11 and get

them down, so it kind of cuts

both

13:52:15 ways, but I do miss hearing

my colleagues and having

13:52:18 that

good kind of back and

13:52:25 forth.

>> I agree with that.

And I

13:52:28 guess the DAR format

seemed -- I think it worked

13:52:31

okay.

Tim, you may have a little

feedback from

13:52:34 what we all

provided, and was that

13:52:38 pretty

helpful in informing

13:52:41 the

applicant?

>> The notes only,

13:52:45 Don?

>> Yes.

>> I think we are still

13:52:48 putting

those packages together, so to

be determined.

To

13:52:51 your point, though, the

deliberation

13:52:57 aspect I think

elevated everyone's

13:53:00 responses.

I think that's something

13:53:05 where

again as we embrace this format,

which we are

13:53:08 forced to, I think

that I am very

13:53:11 optimistic that

we will get better at it.

I

13:53:14 am certainly experiencing

myself going from zero miles per

hour

13:53:18 zoom to 120 miles per hour

13:53:23

zoom.

>> And we can get some feedback

from staff, too, on how

13:53:26 that

first D-

13:53:31 first DAR went.

>> Let's have that

13:53:34 conversation

soon.

>> Yeah.

13:53:37 >> You mean zoom?

13:53:40 >>

13:53:45 Touche.

I love saying this, I will say

it

13:53:48 again, any other questions

about the future?

[Laughter]

>> Something

13:53:51 -- I don't know if

you are going to get to this in

the next one -- but something

that came up

13:53:54 last week that I

was kind of intrigued by is, you

13:53:57

know, I keep my

13:54:01 handy external

hard drive here, which has got

practically everything

13:54:04 that I

know on it, and the

13:54:07 ability if

we were having a deliberation

and an LUR and

13:54:10 trying to tell

somebody about how it's good to

13:54:13

have the awnings at this height

and

13:54:17 trans windows above it, you

can punch, share

13:54:20 screen, with

your commissioners and show them

a precedent.

Show them exactly what you are

talking

13:54:24 about.

We can't do that in the live

13:54:27

room in the meetings, so there

is kind of an interesting thing

there.

What we have got to

13:54:31 be careful,

though, is that doesn't bog down

13:54:34

and take an inordinate amount of

13:54:37

time.

I am intrigued by that, being

able to show an example

13:54:40 --

here's what I am talking about.

This is what I think the

guideline is getting at.

>>

13:54:43 That's great, Bryan.

We talked about that at one of

the

13:54:46 mock hearings when we did

our practice sessions with just

a couple of

13:54:49 groups of you at a

time.

That was something that came

13:54:53

up.

I have already experienced that

nuance of

13:54:56 screen sharing because

you had to, but a picture

13:54:59 says a

thousand words.

>>

13:55:02 Yep.

Yep.

>> Good.

Good.

>> Technically is

13:55:05 that pretty

hard to do, Bryan?

>> What's

13:55:09 that?

>> How does one do that?

>> You see the menu

13:55:12 down in the

center.

There is a Green arrow,

13:55:15 "share

screen."

What it requires you to do, if

you think that

13:55:18 you want to make

a point about something, have

that image

13:55:22 opened and have it

parked somewhere where you don't

have to go searching for it,

13:55:25 so

have anything that's a

precedented thing

13:55:28 that's

relevant sitting there on our

other screen.

13:55:31 Then when your turn comes around

to make your

13:55:35 commentary, you can

just say, my fellow

commissioners, I have

13:55:38 an example

of what I am trying to -- what I

am

13:55:41 talking about here, and just

hit the

13:55:44 "share screen" thing and

bring it up.

>> Do you

13:55:47 see that at the

bottom,

13:55:51 Don?

>> It's in Green?

Sure.

>> I will give you an

13:55:58 example.

>> Here, I will do this since I

like to be

13:56:01 that guy.

Cuz

13:56:06 me?

>> Yep.

>> So this is a picture of

13:56:11 my

space, and we started this as a

team.

We

13:56:14 are all able to see each

other's faces in our

backgrounds,

13:56:17 so we started a

little, where is your office

13:56:21

now?

We miss seeing each other in

their spaces.

13:56:24 So

13:56:28 Don, that's a bit of a screen

share, a little bit of me

13:56:31 making

it work.

>> Okay.

>> Is that

13:56:35 helpful?

>> I

13:56:38 I could pick out the

right gauge of metal and pop

that up on

13:56:41 the

13:56:45 screen.

>> A little replica

13:56:48 activity.

>> Something with no oil

canning, preferably.

>> Yes,

13:56:53 please.

Okay.

Any more questions about

13:56:56 the

future?

13:57:01 Okay.

So future related but just

13:57:06

agenda related, and I guess what

I will do -- I will do it this

13:57:09

way since I can

13:57:12 screen share the

agenda for you

13:57:15 all.

I will just talk and open it

up.

13:57:18 So everyone, if you don't

already, I would

13:57:22 have the agenda

hot linked somewhere on our

desktop.

13:57:25 Laura and Bryan and behind the

13:57:28

scenes Kara and I and hillary

and all the design commission

13:57:32

and staff are constantly hitting

this

13:57:35 agenda, and in the last

couple weeks, never more than I

can ever

13:57:38 remember.

A lot of that had to do with

updating it

13:57:41 regularly.

You can see that Laura was -- or

Bryan was in

13:57:45 here just yesterday

updating this agenda.

This is updated

13:57:49 daily.

It's a good resource.

We spent a lot of

13:57:52 time in this

agenda section here about this

13:57:55

is, obviously, available to the

public.

Some

13:57:58 things about keeping in

mind how we do what

13:58:02 we do.

Covid related warnings.

Why we

13:58:05 are doing virtual

13:58:08

hearings.

But this is where we spent some

time and wanted

13:58:11 to make sure the

public had resources

13:58:14 on to use

this.

This is for you all.

You have received separate

13:58:18

guides as commissioners which

are a little more customized for

your role,

13:58:21 but what we also sent

you was the guides that we have

made

13:58:25 for staff that we have made

for

13:58:29 the public, and that we have

made for the applicant.

We will be updating those

13:58:32

probably weekly as we go forward

through some hearings and

tweaking

13:58:36 things.

Know that this is something that

we really spent some time

13:58:39 on to

kind of help the public navigate

this, as well.

13:58:42 One thing we realized quickly is

13:58:45

we don't know what everyone's

individual

13:58:48 setup is at home and

what they are seeing or how many

screens

13:58:51 that they are using or

their

13:58:54 capability with the

software.

So, we are doing the best that

we can to

13:58:57 make that information

available for people

13:59:01 to

participate from their mobile

device or from their

13:59:06 laptop.

What you will also see here is

this is a

13:59:10 Webinar registration

link that Laura sets up.

These will appear

13:59:13 for hearings

about

13:59:16 two weeks before the

hearing.

The reason why we do it two

weeks before

13:59:19 is we want to make

sure we have all the information

we need.

13:59:23 These links to these hearings,

you receive

13:59:26 separate ones

individually.

You are specifically

13:59:29 invited as

commissioners.

As you know, and you are all

here, so you

13:59:32 have obviously done

it correctly, but what the

public will

13:59:36 see is this link,

and anyone that views this web

Page can click

13:59:39 this link and

register and

13:59:42 participate.

What you will have here is a

list of attendees

13:59:45 that are in

the hearing room.

If you go to

13:59:48 your participants

panel at the bottom of

13:59:52 the

screen, float over

13:59:55 it, you can

click and see people that are

13:59:58

here

14:00:01 listening, probably various

to see how their hearings are

going to go next week.

I think

14:00:04 it's great.

I see some familiar names right

now.

We are going to

14:00:08 invite anyone

that wants to, to

14:00:11 speak, as

well, a little later.

Chair

14:00:14 Julie and I talked about

that, to get that experience for

you

14:00:18 all.

As you roll through, obviously,

we are wrapping

14:00:21 up some notes to

you, and then we are also

14:00:24

looking at the next -- the

hearing for the next

14:00:28 week, which

is full.

We will

14:00:31 be busy, but it's one

where we are looking forward to

managing

14:00:34 well and getting

through all the technical --

14:00:37 and

hopefully no technical

14:00:41 hurdles.

>> So

14:00:44 Tim, you will be

[INAUDIBLE]

>> I am sorry, say that again?

>> Will

14:00:47 you be forwarding these

to us by an

14:00:50 email?

>> Yes.

>> I think he already did.

>> You should have already

14:00:56

gotten it,

14:01:00 Don.

So what you will also get is --

Laura will

14:01:03 put together a poll

for extra dates in July,

14:01:06 August,

and

14:01:09 September.

We are digging out a bit from

the hiatus that

14:01:12 we were on, but

note that

14:01:16 those dates that we

are pulling for are really an

opportunity for

14:01:19 us to shorten

the hearing

14:01:22 lengths.

I know you already knew the

hearings are long.

Sometimes we

14:01:25 have them in the

hearing room.

But

14:01:28 we mentioned about the

fatigue of video

14:01:31 meetings.

I think it's going to be more

important not only that we

14:01:34 learn

the platform and are more

efficient with it, but that we

14:01:38

also have maybe stretched them

out over the

14:01:41 month.

When Laura sends that out, you

know, please let us know when

you

14:01:44 are available.

We are not going to pick every

Thursday

14:01:47 between here and

September, but we do want to

have

14:01:50 the flexibility to move

some hearings around

14:01:53 so we don't

have so long of a day, for

14:01:57

instance, as we might have on

the

14:02:00 21st.

So that really kind of

represents more clearing the

logjam.

14:02:03 It's not the new normal.

We need to have

14:02:06 some flexibility

on

14:02:13 dates.

>> Tim, because of everything

going

14:02:17 on, I don't know about

everyone else's situation, but

at least

14:02:21 mine, I don't know,

actually, what's going to happen

this summer or in the

14:02:24 fall.

I can give you dates that maybe

will be open, but

14:02:28 then could

disappear the week before or two

weeks

14:02:32 before.

I just don't know.

>> Jessica,

14:02:35 totally get it.

I have got

14:02:38 one young kid, and

the whole world

14:02:41 is upside down

with no summer camps this

summer, so we

14:02:45 are still figuring

it out.

All my vacation plans are

14:02:49

tentative or blew up, you know.

So I hear you.

14:02:52 Definitely aware of that, we are

working that out internally, as

I imagine

14:02:55 many people are.

But

14:02:58 again, I am optimistic that

short of

14:03:01 not having to go

downtown for a

14:03:05 hearing, that we

cut the commute time out of the

effort

14:03:08 to host these things.

We had

14:03:11 even had a little

discussion about potentially

thinking about hearing

14:03:15 dates on

different of different days of

the week,

14:03:18 potentially.

Is there a nuance of maybe

getting off of

14:03:21 Thursdays for a

DAR or something

14:03:24 else.

I think it's wide open.

We want to make

14:03:27 it easier for

everyone and not have

14:03:30 long video

conferences on Thursday

14:03:34

afternoons, but scheduling is

challenging, especially with

younger

14:03:39 kids.

I get

14:03:42 that.

>> Okay.

>> Any questions on

14:03:47 that?

>> I have a question.

We were just looking at the

14:03:50

agenda, which is very easy to

find and has all the

14:03:53 links.

I have used it many times.

It's great.

But seeing

14:03:57 that we have a

hearing on the 21st, I am

looking through

14:04:01 my email, and I

don't have it on my

14:04:04 calendar.

I am available and I will be

there, but

14:04:07 -- or I will be here

in my space right now, but I

don't see

14:04:10 it on my calendar yet

so I wanted to check

14:04:13 if it was

on there and I missed it.

>> Is everyone

14:04:17 tracking that --

maybe Laura or Bryan, maybe we

14:04:20

could spend another heads up to

14:04:23

Shandra.

>> Me, as well because for

14:04:27

whatever reason not all meeting

requests are

14:04:31 landing.

>> That one is not an actual

meeting, right?

It is your

14:04:35 DAR comments are

due?

>> DAR

14:04:38 comments, I believe, are

due on Wednesday.

We actually have

14:04:41 hearings on

Thursday.

>> You know, I just looked on my

14:04:45

outlook, and of course I am

usually screwed up on

14:04:48 that, but

I don't have that invite,

either.

>> Neither do

14:04:52 I.

>> Okay.

>> Can I ask a

14:04:56 question?

When you are invited to the

Webinar, you have an option to

14:04:59

put that on our calendar, and

then it saves

14:05:03 the link, your

personal

14:05:06 invite to the hearing.

If I send you

14:05:09 an outlook invite,

you will have two items on

14:05:12

there.

Not to be confused.

I can send an outlook invite

14:05:15 so

you have -- one you put on with

the link and one from

14:05:19 us.

What would you all prefer?

>> Sorry,

14:05:22 Laura, I think you

tried to explain this last time

when we were testing

14:05:25 this out.

I got it

14:05:30 figured out but only

for the meeting today, and I

didn't get it figured

14:05:33 out for

the meeting next week, so maybe

I just need to look.

>> You

14:05:36 should get a reminder

today.

You will get a week

14:05:39 and day and

hour reminder for next week's

14:05:42

hearing.

Those are all -- every time you

get that you will have the

14:05:46

opportunity to add it to your

14:05:51

calendar.

Do you want that?

Or would you like

14:05:54 an outlook

invite?

I don't

14:05:57 want to clog up your

calendar with too many things of

the

14:06:00 same

14:06:04 sort.

>> I am looking through the

hearings clerk emails, and they

14:06:07

are all for the 14th, or so it

14:06:13

seems.

I went through several, the

weekly, the

14:06:16 day, the hour

before, but I don't have the one

for

14:06:19 the 21st.

>> I think it would be really

helpful to just

14:06:22 get it in an

outlook invite.

That

14:06:27 way I know -- that way I

can just go to the calendar and

click on the link

14:06:30 and I am

good.

I don't need to go back through

the emails and

14:06:34 look.

>> Don't mistake the invite,

though, to have your personal

invite

14:06:38 link.

I can't do that --

>>

14:06:43 Oh!

We have personal ones.

>> Yeah, yeah.

>> What is

14:06:46 the first method for

getting this

14:06:49 again?

[Laughter]

>> Okay.

When I create a

14:06:53 Webinar, I have

an option to invite

14:06:57 panelists.

>> Can I jump in?

>> Yeah.

>> One of the problems

14:07:01 is that

all of us have an

14:07:04 outlook invite

on our calendars for

14:07:07 Thursdays

that are regular meetings.

But whether we

14:07:10 would have them

or not have them, you know, it's

been put

14:07:13 in there for a long

14:07:17

time.

Is it possible to -- personally,

I

14:07:21 cannot remove it unless, you

know, I

14:07:24 removed all of it.

Is it possible to

14:07:27 remove those

and then

14:07:30 just having the zoom

invite, so we can click and put

14:07:33

it in our calendar.

No?

>> I can

14:07:36 certainly remove that

automatic outlook

14:07:40 invite.

It just reminded you to watch

every

14:07:43 Thursday -- yeah.

That does not sound like that's

what

14:07:46 the majorities of the

commissioners want.

They

14:07:49 also want reminders.

>> They want both of them.

Okay.

>>

14:07:55 Yeah.

I think we need a consensus.

I don't want to

14:07:58 do it for some

and differently for others.

It will be super confusing

14:08:01 and

tasking.

>> I

14:08:04 think if we have both, it

just sits

14:08:07 side-by-side in your

outlook calendar, but I swear I

don't have the

14:08:11 one for the 21.

>> Me, either.

>> It's not

14:08:14 there.

>> But so just

14:08:17 so that I have

this straight, so the outlook

calendar always is

14:08:20 going to be

independent of our zoom link

because you cannot

14:08:23 send out

individual ones to everybody

with that particular

14:08:26 meeting,

zoom link because you don't have

that.

So

14:08:29 either way the calendar will

notify us of the time and

14:08:32 day,

but we still need to find that

email from the

14:08:37 hearings clerk

from, you know, that is the

latest that gives

14:08:40 us our

personal link because we are

signed in as a

14:08:44 Webinar, not just

as a regular zoom meeting.

>> You

14:08:47 live in your calendar, if

you just add it.

It has an option.

>> If we

14:08:50 add it, right, yes.

Yes.

>> They are

14:08:54 side-by-side.

You just open the one that's the

zoom one, and

14:08:57 it has the link

14:09:01

automatically.

It can sit side-by-side.

>> Even if you

14:09:05 don't save the

first time you get invited, you

will get

14:09:08 the weak reminder, you

will have that option.

You will have

14:09:11 the day and the

hour before so any of those

points

14:09:14 -- if you just watch for

that, you will be able to

14:09:18 click

on the link and attend the

hearing.

>> That's

14:09:21 awesome.

I did not see that link.

That's fantastic.

I would prefer

14:09:24 to not --

>> Could somebody share a screen

and show

14:09:29 us what you are --

>> I can do it.

Hold on.

>> That's

14:09:32 fantastic.

I would prefer for you to not

send me

14:09:35 a calendar link because

you are right, we will have

14:09:38

duplicates.

>> Right, right.

>> This is the invitation she

14:09:42

sends -- Laura sends.

It says, "add to

14:09:45 calendar."

>> We can't see your screen

yet.

>> Oh, sorry.

Hold on.

14:09:50 Share.

There we

14:09:53 go.

Can you see it now?

>> There you go.

Perfect.

>>

14:09:56 So you see how she sends

this.

This is for the

14:10:02 14th.

You can just join it, but you

can also just add it to

14:10:06 your

calendar.

>> That's awesome.

>> Okay.

>> If it's

14:10:09 a Yahoo calendar --

but this is added to

14:10:12 your

outlook calendar.

>> Thank you, Tim.

>> So

14:10:15 maybe -- that's great.

Thank you.

This is great, everyone.

14:10:20 Progress.

Maybe we could side bar it.

Just so you all know one of the

14:10:23

reasons we send out the

14:10:28 outlook

calendar is it alerts the

infrastructure bureaus of

14:10:31 a

hearing date via that outlook

14:10:36

link.

Maybe, Laura, at

14:10:40 our next

meeting we could figure out if

commissioners prefer

14:10:43 -- if you

want to make the zoom

14:10:46 Webinar

email the only one you get from

the

14:10:50 clerks, we could possibly do

that, and you do what you need

to do and add

14:10:53 it to your

respective calendars.

>> I am going to

14:10:57 show this.

Here's how it sits

14:11:01

side-by-side.

>> That's just like mine.

>> This is the outlook one.

>>

14:11:08 Yep.

>> If I need to, if I want to go

to this one this

14:11:11 is where I

connect it to.

>> Yep.

>> The other one

14:11:18 is just the

regular agenda link that we get

sent

14:11:21 by Laura, so we can just

live together.

>> I like

14:11:24 that.

I like that because I like being

able to look out a month in

14:11:27

advance and see what Thursdays

are

14:11:30 locked down.

>>

14:11:33 That's a good

14:11:36 point.

>> If you wanted to, Bryan, you

could lock down you are a your

14:11:39

Thursdays.

[Laughter]

>> Wait a minute, I've been

locked down to two

14:11:42 months now.

14:11:48 [Laughter]

>> Okay.

>> See the handcuffs?

No.

14:11:51 [Laughter]

>> Good huddle.

Thank you, Laura, for clarifying

14:11:55

that.

Is that more helpful for

everyone?

>> It sounds like

14:11:58 we do want the

outlook calendar?

>>

14:12:01 Yeah, let's side bar on it.

I want to

14:12:04 circle back with Kara

and the seniors.

I guess my thought

14:12:08 was maybe we

could avoid sending the outlook

one

14:12:11 to commissioners but send

the invite to staff and

14:12:14 the

bureaus, but let's huddle on

14:12:17

that and decide something moving

forward.

14:12:21 Does that sound cool, Laura?

>> Yeah.

>> Right

14:12:24 on.

>> I kind of thought that the

system you have right now

14:12:28 works

great -- pretty well for me.

I get the notice the day in

14:12:31

advance, and I just click on

it.

>> That's all

14:12:34 Laura.

That's great.

The zoom meeting -- having those

reminders with

14:12:37 the zoom like a

week, day, and

14:12:40 hour before -- we

are all for it.

We will keep that for sure.

>> Thank

14:12:43 you, Laura.

>> Yeah, thank

14:12:47 you.

>> She's the zoom master.

>> Not

14:12:53 really.

[Laughter]

>>

14:12:56 Okay.

So three more items on the

agenda really quick.

I am going to

14:13:00 -- it will be DOZA

questions and a zoom

14:13:03 meeting

snapshot, but I want to take a

chance with questions

14:13:06 and invite

some attendees up to

14:13:10 testify if

you will.

But let's get through

14:13:14 DOZA.

Staci, you are here, and Laura

is here,

14:13:17 too.

Thank you for coming, Laura

Do you want to

14:13:20 do a quick

14:13:23 DOZA

update?

>>

14:13:27 Yes.

[Laughter]

Give me one

14:13:31 second.

Okay.

Hello.

I

14:13:34 sent all of you an email

14:13:38

yesterday providing a brief time

line about the next

14:13:41 steps of

14:13:44

DOZA I put that on a sheet -- or

a presentation that I would like

to share with

14:13:47 you.

14:13:56 It's right here.

Cuz

14:14:00 Can you see my screen?

There we go.

14:14:05 Okay.

So it's been quiet for

14:14:08 a while.

I wanted to bring you up to

speed on

14:14:11 DOZA because it will be

going full speed ahead starting

next

14:14:15 week.

So next week you will be

receiving

14:14:21 packets with the

amendments from

14:14:24 BPS that reflect

the prior discussions at work

14:14:27

sessions that you've been

14:14:30 conducting I think since last

14:14:33 October of 2019.

All of that

14:14:37 hard work has been

folded into a

14:14:40 revised document,

so you should be receiving that

next

14:14:45 week.

Next Thursday Laura will be

attending

14:14:48 from BPS, and she is

just going to brief

14:14:51 the

commission on a really high

level overview of

14:14:54 the amendments

and give you specific

instructions about how to

14:14:57 review

the documents and provide

comments to

14:15:02 her for discussion

on June 4th.

So you will have

14:15:05 two weeks

between May

14:15:08 19th and

June 4th to comb through those

revisions

14:15:11 and make sure that

they reflect

14:15:14 your prior

discussion and comments from the

past year or

14:15:19 so.

Again, next week Laura will just

be giving a

14:15:22 high level overview

in order

14:15:25 to make June 4th be a

very efficient

14:15:28 hearing.

She will give you specific

instructions on how to

14:15:31 provide

any comments.

So I will get into the first

hearing, it will

14:15:34 be June 4th.

That's when

14:15:37 you, as

commissioners, will bring any of

your comments or

14:15:41 edits for

discussion at that

14:15:46 hearing.

If they are all minor changes,

meaning you

14:15:49 can easily dictate

14:15:53

the edits to Laura, it's

possible that you could

14:15:55 actually

vote on our recommendation to

the city council on

14:15:59 June 4th.

That's the hope.

If there are

14:16:02 more significant

amendments that requires

14:16:05 BPS to,

actually, fine tune the language

and bring it back to the

14:16:10

commission, we will be returning

on

14:16:13 June 18th for hopefully the

14:16:17

final hearing why Laura will

present any revised or amended

14:16:20

language that you requested from

the prior

14:16:24 hearing.

If the vote doesn't occur on

June 4th, that would be

14:16:27 the

date that you would be voting on

a recommendation to city

14:16:32

council.

On July 16th the

14:16:36 Macadam

character statements, which will

be the first adapted

14:16:39 character

statement for the new design

guidelines, will be

14:16:42 coming to

the design commission.

This will be

14:16:45 a public hearing.

You are the recommending

14:16:49 body

for the first character

14:16:52

statement to the city

14:16:55 council.

I believe at this hearing,

again, this will be a public

hearing on

14:16:58 a legislative

project, so the public will be

14:17:01

providing testimony, and the PSC

might also be

14:17:04 providing their

testimony on the character

14:17:09

statement.

So that's kind of what

14:17:12 DOZA

looks like.

14:17:15 While it's in your courted, we

are

14:17:19 court, we are

not sure of the next step when

it goes to council.

There is other

14:17:22 pressing stuff

council is working on, the hope

is to still have it go before

14:17:25

council for

14:17:29 adoption this year,

but I am sure that Laura can

provide you an update

14:17:32 with that

at the hearing next week.

14:17:36 Does anyone have any questions

about what to expect for the

14:17:40

next month or so for DOZA?

>>

14:17:43 Is the June 18th and

July 16th

14:17:46 written testimony

from

14:17:50 us?

>> It's not testimony.

June 18th will be an

opportunity

14:17:53 for you to review

any

14:17:57 revised language you request

of Laura, or BPS, from the

14:18:00

June 4th

14:18:04 hearing.

>> And then there is a vote.

>> Correct.

>>

14:18:07 And again, you are a

recommending body so you will

14:18:10 be

voting on a recommendation to

city council.

14:18:13 The same is true for the

14:18:19

July 16th.

Any other questions?

14:18:23 Laura, you are also here.

Do you have anything to add?

14:18:27 >> I don't think that I have

anything to

14:18:30 add.

Good to see your faces, and I

look forward

14:18:33 to talking with you

next week.

14:18:39 >> We also have a 3-by-3 on the

calendar tomorrow,

14:18:42 though,

right?

That's still happening?

>> Correct.

>> Okay.

14:18:46 Great.

>> I have a

14:18:51 question.

So this is

14:18:54 in general.

We are moving ahead

14:18:57 with this

14:19:01

DOZA implementation as if Covid

has not

14:19:05 happened.

Covid happened, and

14:19:08 it's going

to have massive

14:19:12 ramifications in

terms of the development and

urban design

14:19:16 and everything.

Has the

14:19:19 bureau of planning and

sustainability and BDS even

thought

14:19:24 about what the

ramification of the future

14:19:28

changes will

14:19:33 be on these

14:19:36

guidelines, and whether we just

forge

14:19:41 ahead and then if the fog

14:19:45

lifts, then if needed we do

another amendment.

I just

14:19:48 wanted to put that out

14:19:52

there.

>> I will speak for BDS.

We have not had

14:19:55 the conversation

about how this -- how

14:19:58 the

current times impact all this

work, but I think that we

believe that

14:20:01 there's been so

much effort, gosh,

14:20:04 four years or

so, five years put into this

document into

14:20:07 all this work that

the plan is to forge

14:20:10 ahead

because this is not about a

short-term

14:20:13 solution.

This is about the city's

14:20:17

future.

BPS could have had other

conversations.

I am

14:20:20 not sure.

Laura if you want to share

anything or have anything to

14:20:24

share?

>>

14:20:27 I was muted.

This is certainly not a

five-minute

14:20:32 conversation.

I've been thinking about this a

lot because so much

14:20:35 of what we

have written and talked about

and championed

14:20:38 together is about

social interaction

14:20:42 and gathering

and the ability for people of

all

14:20:45 different backgrounds to

14:20:51

impromptu meet.

How do we make that work in the

14:20:54

city, and how do we make the

city, you know,

14:20:57 the best space

-- provide the best

14:21:01 spaces in

the future.

I still think -- I've been

14:21:04

reading over the document and

thinking about this -- I

14:21:08 still

think a lot of what we have

14:21:11 said

and talked about together still

14:21:14

holds true.

I think it's even more important

for

14:21:18 us to champion the diversity

of public spaces

14:21:21 and make sure

that there

14:21:24 is ample room for

people to

14:21:28 move about and

champion people's access

14:21:31 to

light and

14:21:34 air and balconies and

welcoming sprees

14:21:40

entrys and things like that.

I don't know that there is a lot

of huge changes in the

14:21:43

guidelines, but I think that I

would put this back to you and

use

14:21:46 this as a

14:21:50 lens to think

about how our guidelines can

remain

14:21:54 timeless in this moment,

but also, hopefully as we

14:21:59 get

back to -- I don't want to be

cliche in saying a new

14:22:02 normal,

but I am not sure what else, you

know,

14:22:05 our future, our better

future together --

>> I

14:22:08 would like to chime in on

14:22:13

that.

There is going to be a vaccine

at some

14:22:16 point.

This particular event is --

14:22:19 are

we expecting to have a virus

every two years and have this

14:22:22 be

a consistent event over the

years?

We hope not.

We hope this

14:22:25 is a 100-year

event, like

14:22:28 the pandemic like

the Spanish

14:22:31 flu

14:22:36 of 19 -- yeah,

1718.

It was two years of that.

14:22:39 The science wasn't there to get

us where we possibly could get

14:22:43

here.

We've been having these

discussions

14:22:46 internally, as a

business.

14:22:49 We build, buildings for people.

We build buildings

14:22:52 where people

interact and amenity spaces and

ground floors and

14:22:55 what have

you.

I think that this is going to

14:23:00 be

incredibly painful of a period

where there is going to be a lot

of, you

14:23:03 know, where we are

reacting to a lot of things, but

I think we are going to

14:23:07 get

through this at some point.

There will be a vaccine.

14:23:10 There will be an

14:23:13 immunity, a

combination of one and the

other, and eventually there will

14:23:16

be a pentup demand to

14:23:19 go out and

meet people and be with

14:23:22 people

and have interactive

interactions with

14:23:27 people.

In terms of the design review,

one of the things that I

14:23:30 see is

you are crazy if you think you

are going to

14:23:33 lease some retail

today.

So our

14:23:36 active ground floors will

be really not very active for a

long

14:23:39 time until -- well, a long

time.

It could be 18

14:23:43 months before we

can go to a restaurant on a

regular

14:23:46 basis.

The Governor just issued, you

know, what is

14:23:52 phase one opening

where you can have a restaurant

with ten people in it as long as

they

14:23:55 can keep six feet

14:23:59 apart.

Who is going to want to go to

that?

There will be restaurant

14:24:02 and

store failures and all sorts

14:24:05 of

disruptions.

That said, we are not

14:24:09

redesigning buildings, you know,

for example, we are

14:24:12 not

redesigning buildings to have a

little home office because we

think that we

14:24:15 all are going to

be working out of our home

14:24:18

office or our bedrooms or

14:24:21

whatever.

I think eventually the new

normal might be

14:24:24 a combination of

materials

14:24:27 that are needed to

clean spaces or

14:24:30 to maintain, but

eventually, we will all

14:24:34 be back

to a certain degree of

togetherness because we are

human

14:24:37 beings.

Frankly, I think everybody

14:24:40 is

already suffering from you know,

the cabin fever.

It's

14:24:43 true.

If you don't leave your house,

you will go

14:24:49 crazy.

You will probably strangle our

kids, you know, something

14:24:52 of

that nature because there comes

a point that we need to be

14:24:55

interactive.

So what I am saying is I

14:25:00 think

that the outcome of

14:25:04 DOZA is --

might look out of place, but we

will be

14:25:07 in place once this

14:25:10 is

over, and I shut my mouth.

>> One other thing that's

14:25:14 going

on where there is a group of

14:25:18 us,

there is a number of cities that

are changing the use of the

public

14:25:21 right-of-ways, kicking

cars out and

14:25:25 taking over street

space for new-found public open

14:25:28

space.

I read something in Cincinnati

is now

14:25:31 has closed some streets

to traffic so restaurants can

have

14:25:34 more seating outdoors where

you have got fresh air

14:25:37 movement

and you can spread the tables

out and stuff like that.

14:25:40

Some of these cities are saying

that we're not going to reopen

14:25:44

these streets to cars, so there

could

14:25:47 be something -- I don't

know how directly this

14:25:51 relates

to DOZA because it gets into the

realm of

14:25:54 p

14:25:58 PBOT, but it's a

trend that we are keeping our

eyes on,

14:26:01 reimagining and

repurposing of public right of

ways for public

14:26:06 space.

That could have

14:26:09 an indirect

effect on how we look at

projects.

14:26:12 >> Well, I didn't want to open

the pandora's box

14:26:18 here.

But, I just want to make

14:26:21 sure

that -- Sam, I agree with you

that

14:26:25 Covid may be is a year or

two issue, but

14:26:28 it's what this

has illuminated

14:26:31 is that what

happens in the case of a

14:26:34 major

catastrophe, how people behave,

what their

14:26:37 needs are.

Those are, you know, people's

14:26:40

needs, either social

interaction, the need

14:26:44 for social

interaction.

The need for being away from

each

14:26:47 other -- they all have

14:26:50

ramification on the design, and

especially in the public realm.

14:26:53 My

14:26:57 question was if this is not

the time to answer those

14:27:03

questions, would we be prepared

to be

14:27:10 flexible and modify things

to be

14:27:14 responsive to the

changes.

>> I hear you.

I think that it's

14:27:17 a valid --

it's a super important

14:27:20

question.

I just -- the nature

14:27:23 of this is

so unique that you can't

14:27:26 be next

to anybody else.

>>

14:27:30 Right.

>> This is what we are trying to

14:27:34

do, so I don't

14:27:37 see that --

anyway.

>> I think you are right, Sam.

I think it's too early.

14:27:40 We are going to see and

14:27:43 know

more as this plays out over the

next year

14:27:46 about how we -- if we

need to adjust and how we

14:27:50

adjust.

>> Yeah.

>> I have a fear

14:27:53 that retail is

going to

14:27:57 be probably further

hurt by the -- by this

14:28:00 virus,

and we're never going to go back

to streets as

14:28:04 busy as we have

known them before the virus

14:28:09

hit.

I think that there is going to

be more and more people used to

ordering

14:28:12 stuff on Amazon,

14:28:17 Etc.

Retail has already been

struggling, and I think it will

14:28:21

be -- essentially, it will be

exacerbated.

>> Have

14:28:24 I told you how good I

have gotten at folding up

14:28:27

cardboard boxes and filling my

recycling bin

14:28:30 every week?

[Laughter]

14:28:36 God!

Because of all the stuff that

comes to the door.

>> And you have probably gotten

14:28:39

used to it, and are you going to

go back and shop?

>> I know.

I

14:28:43 know.

>> Are you ever going back?

So that

14:28:46 impacts the ground

floors of buildings, and what do

we do

14:28:50 with all of this space.

That's a

14:28:54 discussion that

warrants, I guess, more

14:28:57 review

going forth.

14:29:01 Currently, we require a lot of

retail on the ground floor,

14:29:04 and

we might never see a lot of

those get

14:29:07 occupied.

>>

14:29:11 Right.

>> I have a really dumb question

14:29:14

about DOZA for

14:29:17 Staci and Laura.

The packets

14:29:21 with amendments that

are going

14:29:24 to arrive in the

14:29:27

commissioners' hands on the

19th, are those hard copy

packets or

14:29:30 electronic packets?

>> Those are hard copy packets.

I

14:29:33 was just going to bring that

14:29:39

up.

So I've been in touch with

Laura, and she has provided the

14:29:43

addresses for the courier to get

-- it's going to go

14:29:46 straight

from the printer to

14:29:50 your

designated addresses.

I am told the couriers will

14:29:53 just

ring a doorbell or knock on a

door.

They are not going to wait for

14:29:56

anybody to answer.

14:30:01 Know that they are coming

straight from the printer.

They

14:30:04 will be color copies, but

we will

14:30:07 also provide a -- we

will also

14:30:10 send you a PDF, as

14:30:14

well.

>> Did I answer your question?

>> Thank you very much.

>>

14:30:17 So -- and the amendments,

just to remind you,

14:30:19 it's going

to look like the proposed

draft.

It's a

14:30:23 revised proposed draft.

14:30:26

So it will be -- what are your

14:30:30

revisions look like in the

document.

The changes will

14:30:34 be highlighted,

so you will see what's changed

since the proposed

14:30:38 draft.

I don't know what -- if

commissioners

14:30:41 were able to take

14:30:45

their proposed drafts with them,

so I don't know if you have

those

14:30:48 hard copies with you?

I don't know if you have the

table of

14:30:51 amendments with you?

We

14:30:54 can provide links to those in

case you need

14:30:57 a

cross-reference.

>> Okay.

Thank you very

14:31:00 much, Laura.

>> Sure.

14:31:08 >> I just had a quick question

for

14:31:13 Tim, if he's still there?

>> Oh, Don, I am always

14:31:19 here.

>> It's your house.

I have to admit, I did get

14:31:22 a

warning, my internet is

14:31:25

unstable, so don't take it

personally.

>> Have you seen

14:31:29 people pulling

projects from the queue

14:31:33 because

of the virus and the

implications of that

14:31:36 for

long-term

14:31:39 development?

>> I have seen some sliding

around

14:31:42 or holdings.

Not so much off the

14:31:45 queue.

I don't have a full

14:31:48 grasp of the

numbers right now.

It's

14:31:55 slower.

>> We knew that was going to

happen, but I was just curious

if

14:31:58 things are really falling off

a cliff or things

14:32:01 are still --

>> No, we have seen some

projects that are

14:32:05 forecasted out

like looking into the fall like

the

14:32:09 PCs, decent sized

projects, enough to be excited.

I think

14:32:12 that's part of our

resolve here

14:32:15 today moving

forward is the show that we

could do this

14:32:18 -- to show that we

could do this work.

I could go

14:32:21 on and on about the

stuff that I am hearing

14:32:24 and

seeing behind the scenes with

everyone working

14:32:27 remotely at the

drop of a hat and how the

14:32:30 bureau

is rallying to support the staff

and get

14:32:34 equipment out and get

technology out and get us

14:32:37 ramped

up to do this thing.

Given the

14:32:42 summer ahead, and it's

-- we have to do

14:32:49 it.

>> Okay.

>> That's what you get from me,

Don.

>>

14:32:54 Okay.

The development community is

getting pretty nervous about

what the

14:32:57 economy is going to

look like in a couple of years,

and

14:33:00 therefore, delaying or

14:33:03

suspending the projects.

>> I know one developer

14:33:06 that's

in this virtual hearing room

that might offer some thoughts.

I don't

14:33:09 know, Sam, do you want

to --

>>

14:33:13 Sure.

I can give you an opinion on

it.

I think at this point everybody

is

14:33:16 trying to -- again, it's a

14:33:20

very turbulent

14:33:23 time with muddy

waters where we cannot really

see where things

14:33:26 are going.

In general, the financial

14:33:30

markets are also in a world that

they

14:33:33 don't understand.

None of us do.

The way I like to

14:33:36 put it is just

think of this as you had a board

14:33:39

game and you knew where all the

pieces were, and

14:33:42 someone

scrambled it, and now you have

to figure out where the pieces

are now

14:33:45 because they are in

different places, and people

have taken

14:33:48 different attitudes.

The banks are pretty much

14:33:52 frozen

right now even though there is

tons of

14:33:57 liquidity.

Basically, they don't know what

to lend

14:34:00 to, what are the terms,

and when they are giving you

terms, the

14:34:03 terms that are so

obnoxious that you cannot accept

14:34:09

them.

So the investors

14:34:12 community --

there are a lot of these that

are pension funds and so

14:34:15 forth

which took a beating in the

stock market

14:34:19 initially or

still.

So they are all,

14:34:22 you know,

asking for their money, and

having redemptions that they

14:34:25

need to deal with, so --

14:34:28 the

same with the insurance

companies.

So they are pretty

14:34:32 much frozen.

Everybody -- the

14:34:35 mantra is

extend, extend, extend.

Don't

14:34:38 commit any new dollars to

14:34:42

anything just see if you can

start the projects in three,

14:34:45

four, five, six months.

In general what I

14:34:48 am assuming

you will see is that the same

thing

14:34:51 is happening if it was

close to a good

14:34:55 stopping point,

people just go out to that point

and stop and are waiting to see

14:34:59

if they can hold on to their

land.

They are asking for extensions

14:35:02

from sellers if there is the

option.

14:35:05 The other thing that's happening

is that there is a

14:35:08 general

expectation that the

construction costs are going to

go down, which hasn't

14:35:13 happened.

It's too short of a period.

We saw some

14:35:17 of that happen.

The great recession.

14:35:20 It took a long time before that

14:35:23

happened.

Materials, wood prices went down

so everybody was expecting that

to

14:35:27 sort of -- the Mills stopped

working anyway, so the

14:35:30 supply

just kind of, you know,

14:35:34

dwindled.

So it's a very, very

14:35:37 fluid,

incredibly unstable

14:35:42 market.

Restaurants are not getting

their workers back even if they

are able

14:35:45 to open.

If they are able to open with

ten

14:35:48 people, does it make sense

to open at all, so it's such

14:35:52 a

-- retail, what is the retail

value of -- what is the

14:35:55 value of

retail

14:35:58 from an investor

perspective.

It's so jumbled

14:36:01 up that nobody

knows whether it's up or down or

left or right,

14:36:04 and everybody is

trying to find

14:36:08 that.

What I would envision would

happen for the design review

14:36:12

perspective is everybody is just

saying hold off.

I am not going to do this right

14:36:18

now.

You will see a trickle of

projects that might start

14:36:21

getting, you know,

14:36:24 financing or

investors or, you know, the

14:36:27

construction cost starts to make

sense.

But rents are going

14:36:30 down so from

a residential perspective,

14:36:33

projects make less sense than

they did, I

14:36:37 mean, already very

thin projects that made

14:36:40 some

sense two months ago, don't make

any

14:36:43 sense right now.

>>

14:36:46 Okay.

>> My expectation is we are

going to be in a slump for a

couple

14:36:50 of years.

Then things will probably

14:36:53 pick

up maybe 2002, 2003, or

14:36:56

something like that.

So the

14:37:01 workload will be less for

the design commission for the

next

14:37:07 couple years.

The workload that we had

14:37:11 in

2015, 2016, 2017, is really

intense.

So many

14:37:14 projects.

I would expect that to drop by

half or three quarters for the

14:37:17

next year or

14:37:22 two.

>> Time will tell.

>>

14:37:27 Yeah.

>> If any other DOZA related

14:37:30

questions, commissioners?

I want to

14:37:34 keep -- I don't want

14:37:37

to keep Staci or Laura any

longer than they

14:37:40 might want to

stay.

>> Even though she's away from

her

14:37:43 kids, she's probably

14:37:47

grateful.

[Laughter]

>> Thank you for your time, and

I will see

14:37:50 you at the hearing

next Thursday.

Let me know if you have any

14:37:54

questions.

>> Great.

Thank you.

>> Thanks.

>> Thanks.

>>

14:37:57 Thanks, Laura.

Thank you for coming on.

>> Thank you,

14:38:00 Laura.

>> That's

14:38:04 great.

So chair Julie -- I had two

14:38:07

things on the items of interest

left, and that would be

14:38:11

questions of commissioners -- we

have had a bunch of

14:38:14 questions

that covered quite a bit

already, and then the last

14:38:18 item

was -- and Hillary offered, if

14:38:21 I

can get her to do it, we can do

a zoom

14:38:24 first commission hearing

14:38:28

screen shot when you are ready

for it.

14:38:32 if you are all willing.

That's really all that I

14:38:35 had

planned.

Are there other things that you

would like to talk

14:38:39 about -- yes,

Commissioner.

>> Really

14:38:42 briefly on zoom

meeting room protocols, I think

that we

14:38:45 are closed captioned.

>> Yes.

>> Yes.

Laura --

>>

14:38:48 Does that change how we

14:38:51 --

does that change

14:38:54 what -- how we

want to present ourselves?

Do we always want

14:38:57 to introduce

ourselves?

>> Yes,

14:39:01 yes.

>> Yeah.

>> Yes.

Thank you.

>> Okay.

>>

14:39:05 Yeah.

I might have otherwise led with

that.

You

14:39:08 are correct.

With closed captioning

14:39:11 -- and I

can obviously see your faces,

and I know the sound

14:39:14 of all your

voices, but someone

14:39:17 landing into

a room that is

14:39:20 either hearing or

sight impaired, the closed

14:39:23

captioning provides that

14:39:29

option.

Go ahead, Julie.

>> Today probably not a very big

14:39:32

deal because we are a small

group, but next week whenever --

I

14:39:35 think the protocol is whenever

someone is going to

14:39:38 speak, to

get them -- to begin

14:39:41 with an

introduction.

>> Yeah.

14:39:46 Yeah.

>> We need to get more in the

habit

14:39:49 of doing that.

Little inserts between

14:39:53 some

statements -- those will kind of

slip through, but if you are

14:39:57 say

giving a thing about a project

or something like that or

14:40:00

launching into a question, it

would be good to lead with, you

14:40:06

know, this is planner Tim

Heron.

>> So Julie, I also think we

14:40:09

need

14:40:12 something to draw your

attention to the fact that we

have a

14:40:15 question.

How do we do

14:40:19 that without

jumping and interrupting

somebody else.

>> Yeah, I think we

14:40:22 will want to

make really good use of

14:40:25 the

participants'

14:40:29 list.

If your mouse is live at the

bottom of your

14:40:32 zoom window, your

zoom frame, there should

14:40:35 be a

little icon of participants.

Mine looks

14:40:40 like two people, and

it has a number

14:40:43 "17" next to it

because there are 17 people

participating.

If you click on

14:40:46 that, you get a

really useful panel along the

14:40:49

right side of the zoom

14:40:53 window.

That is a shortcut to know whose

mic is on, whose video

14:40:57 is on.

There is also, I think, an

opportunity to

14:41:00 raise hands

here.

Is that

14:41:04 enabled on our current

zoom?

>> It is.

>> Commissioner Jessica just

14:41:07

raised her hand.

It comes up on the screen.

There you go.

>>

14:41:10 And Jessica, will you tell us

how you raised your

14:41:14 hand, and we

can all practice?

>> Once you have

14:41:17 the participant

panel open at the very bottom,

there is

14:41:20 a raise and lower hand

button.

There are three

14:41:23 buttons, invite,

mute, and raise hand.

>> I don't have

14:41:27 that.

>> I don't have that, either.

>> Go to the

14:41:31 ellipses.

There is an ellipses, which

should be the

14:41:34 bottom right --

>> The little dots.

Yes.

14:41:37 Okay.

Raise hand.

Got

14:41:40 it.

>> There is little dots some

place?

>> It's like a little box with

14:41:43

three dots on the very right

hand.

>> Oh, yeah,

14:41:46 yeah.

I have got it.

Okay.

14:41:50 Good.

That's a good one.

>> That's

14:41:54 great.

>> I don't see that.

I see participants,

14:41:57 17, share

screen.

>>

14:42:00 Click that first.

>> Yep.

>> Click

14:42:04 participants.

>> Okay.

>> I still see two

14:42:07 people and

17.

>> But you should have had a

window pop

14:42:10 -- you might have

popups

14:42:13 blocked.

You should have had a window pop

up that

14:42:16 has the participants.

>> Okay.

It has a

14:42:19 list of all the

participants, but --

>> That's it.

>> Go to

14:42:22 the very bottom, Don.

There is

14:42:26 a box with three DOS on

14:42:29 -- three

dots on the right-hand side of

the

14:42:32 bottom.

>> Let's see, I see Rachelle --

14:42:35

>> Farther down.

>> I see it says,

14:42:38 raise hand.

>> That's it.

>>

14:42:43 Yeah.

>> Your hand is raised.

>> Boom!

You did it.

[Laughter]

14:42:47 >> Meeting adjourned.

[Laughter]

>> Fantastic.

>> I have another question,

14:42:53

though, these are people in the

Webinar, correct?

14:42:57 So that --

14:43:00 grace,

14:43:04 Hillary, we

are attending like someone would

attend in the audience?

>> The next

14:43:07 move right now would

be Julia is going to

14:43:10 ask if any

of them wanted to testify and

what

14:43:13 Laura and -- or Bryan were

going to do, once we see a show

14:43:16

of hands, would be to promote

them if you will from

14:43:20 attendee

to panelist, and at that point,

if they wanted to share their

video they

14:43:24 could.

If they were testifying.

>> Let's go through that.

Yeah.

>>

14:43:27 If they don't that's fine.

They can simply

14:43:31 speak.

When the invite goes to

attendees,

14:43:34 basically they are

invited to speak.

They don't have

14:43:37 to.

What will happen is the premise

will go to them and

14:43:40 say you are

invited to speak, and then they

need to select whether or not

14:43:43

they turn their microphone on or

14:43:48

off.

I am not sure which testifier

that was.

14:43:51 [Laughter]

[ dog barking]

>> Whose dog

14:43:54 was that?

>> So I guess

14:43:57 Julia, this could

be a good time.

I happened to reach

14:44:00 out to

[inaudible].

I know that she would be

available to at

14:44:03 least speak

maybe or may not with the video,

but I

14:44:07 guess I would open it

up to you

14:44:09 to ask if there is any

attend

14:44:15 ees that

would like to testify.

And let's go from there.

>> There are four

14:44:20 attendees in

our hearing today, and I would

like

14:44:22 to invite any or all of the

attendees to

14:44:26 raise their hand

through the participants list

14:44:29

and tell us that you would like

to provide some

14:44:33 public

testimony, or at least help us

test drive

14:44:36 public testimony.

We want to be sure the systems

14:44:42 are working.

>> Shy people.

>>

14:44:45 Well, I think there might be

a moment,

14:44:48 too, where -- frankly,

this is an issue where it's part

of

14:44:51 zoom fatigue where you don't

have that more immediate

14:44:55 human

connection.

So sometimes it makes -- it may

take

14:44:58 time for someone to raise

or not, and we don't necessarily

always

14:45:01 know if someone is

actively

14:45:04 listening or

participating.

>> Okay.

>> All right,

14:45:07 Lee and Hillary

have both raised their

14:45:10 hands.

I am

14:45:14 going to --

>> And you have control, too,

14:45:17

Julia, if you want to, or you

can ask

14:45:21 Laura.

>> There is Grace Jeffreys's

hand.

14:45:24 Laura, would you like me to

promote or would you like to

promote?

>> You

14:45:27 know, either way.

It seems pretty smooth you

14:45:30 doing

it because you are also

introducing

14:45:34 them at the same

time, but either way.

You just let us know in

14:45:38 each

hearing.

>> Right on.

I am happy to do it.

So I am going

14:45:41 to invite Lee

14:45:45

Algood in first for two minutes

of trial and error public

testimony

14:45:49 followed by

14:45:52 Hillary

Adams followed by Grace

Jeffreys.

Thanks for being willing to

14:45:55 be

Guinea pigs.

Here we go with promoting Lee to

14:45:58

a panelist.

14:46:05 Okay.

>> Can you hear me?

>> Yes.

Very

14:46:09 nice.

>> It's good to see you all, and

this has been really interesting

to watch.

I

14:46:12 am really impressed that staff

has you all up and running

14:46:15 so

smoothly, so quickly.

14:46:18 So just -- do you want to hear

feedback about

14:46:21 the observers

side?

>> We

14:46:27 do.

>> Please.

>> So what happens when you

promoted me to panelist is

14:46:31 that

everything disappears and I

rejoined so there was a moment

where I

14:46:34 am not in the meeting.

There will be

14:46:38 a pause as someone

is transitioning over.

14:46:42 Also, I was emailing with Tim

that at a certain point

14:46:45 when you

were calling for testimony

14:46:48 my

hand

14:46:52 disappeared.

It reappeared, and I raised it,

but initially I was

14:46:55 not able to

do that.

That's what happened

14:46:58 there.

And I will be seeing you all

again next week, so that's why I

14:47:01

am here observing how this

14:47:05

works.

>> Thanks for being willing to

do this

14:47:08 today.

We will be very patient with the

14:47:12

transition from attendees to

panelists and moving

14:47:15 between,

how moving between rooms works.

>> Thank

14:47:19 you.

>> Julie, just an observation

that maybe someone can comment

14:47:22

on before when I saw

14:47:25 Li in the

list of attendees, it said

14:47:28

"talking permitted" in

parenthesis, but she had

14:47:32 not

been transferred or changed into

a

14:47:35 panelist, so is there another

way that someone can participate

without

14:47:38 you having to transfer

between attendee and

14:47:41

participant?

Does anyone know how that's

working?

>> Yeah,

14:47:44 actually, we discussed

not moving

14:47:47 the attendees to

panelist unless they had

something

14:47:50 to

14:47:54 share.

When she was named, I went in

and allowed her

14:47:58 to speak, so you

saw that happen, and then Julie

14:48:02

turned her attendee to panelist,

so that's what you saw

14:48:05 happen.

>> So we -- I tripped over you,

14:48:08

Laura.

You were out in front there

14:48:11

making the transition, and I

just did something that did not

need to be

14:48:15 done.

>> Oh, no.

That's something that we are

still

14:48:18 discussing.

Do we want to make them

panelists every time, or do we

14:48:21

want to keep them in the

attendee mode to

14:48:24 speak?

They still can speak, but

14:48:27 the

first step would be allow them

once we named them.

>>

14:48:33 Okay.

They can be seen?

>> Say that again,

14:48:36 Sam?

>> They have to be panelists to

be seen?

>>

14:48:40 Yes.

>> So if they are in the waiting

-- I mean in the

14:48:43 other room and

can speak, you can make them do

that -- you don't see

14:48:46 them

unless you make them panelists.

>>

14:48:50 Correct.

>> It's a zoom permission

setting.

>> I am not sure about

14:48:55 that.

Hillary, I made you to be able

to speak.

Let's see if

14:48:58 we see you.

>> Yes.

I can

14:49:01 speak.

>> So we see her name.

>> I think

14:49:04 you meant video,

Sam.

>> Can

14:49:07 you throw on our

14:49:10 video,

Hillary?

>> I don't have that option.

>> Let's make you a

14:49:14 panelist.

>> Sure.

>> We are going to pop you to

panelist and

14:49:18 see what -- have

you go to video.

>> Who

14:49:21 does that?

>> Laura, Julie or

14:49:24 I.

Basically the hosts or co-hosts

or

14:49:27 Bryan.

That's the upper tier, if you

14:49:32

will, of the permission

settings.

>> Hey.

>>

14:49:35 Hi.

>> So Sam and Julie, this is

something which we

14:49:38 specifically

discussed.

I think originally

14:49:42 rolling into

this we didn't appreciate the

14:49:45

experience of an attendee versus

a panelist.

A

14:49:48 panelist generally is a broad

experience.

14:49:51 You can see the video or the

screen.

14:49:54 The attendees, it feels like you

14:49:57

have blinders on.

It's a different experience from

the public's

14:50:01 perspective, and we

are struggling with that, I

think.

14:50:04 So what we've decided, at least

moving

14:50:07 forward, is giving people

the option to share their video

if they want

14:50:10 to, but the only

way that we can do that is if we

promote

14:50:13 them out from the

attendee box and into the

14:50:16

panelist box.

14:50:20 Part of the -- just the meeting

14:50:23

gymnastics there, at least on

Laura and Bryan's

14:50:26 part, is

having too many panelists to

manage, sort,

14:50:29 and invite and

participate.

There is a bit of a

14:50:33 sorting

factor.

I think we are going to try it

out and see how it

14:50:39 goes.

>> We could, before someone is

promoted from attendee to

14:50:42

panelist, we could just ask

them, right, give them the

opportunity

14:50:46 to speak and say,

would you like us to move you to

video?

>> That

14:50:48 could be just a protocol

we build in.

Yep.

14:50:51 Okay.

Noted.

>> I have a quick question,

14:50:55 if

you move over to video, you can

share your

14:50:57 screen, too.

>> Correct.

>>

14:51:01 Yes.

>> I could see how that would be

good and

14:51:04 bad.

>> Yeah.

>> So we

14:51:07 will figure it out.

I think that we will practice.

This was

14:51:10 good.

Thank you, Li, for offering

14:51:14

that.

Here's Hillary, do you ever

something to say?

>>

14:51:17 I

14:51:20 do.

I agree with Li, my little hand

14:51:24

went away.

That's why you did not get

responses right

14:51:27 away, probably.

>> What was

14:51:31 that?

>> I am not sure why that

happened.

We had the ability

14:51:34 earlier on,

and then when I got ready for

you all to

14:51:37 speak, I looked and

it was gone.

I am not sure

14:51:40 if someone

accidentally hit it who is also

a

14:51:44 co-host.

It's weird it went away.

>> Yeah.

>> It came back.

>>

14:51:48 Okay.

>> That's because I had to put

it back on.

>> The other

14:51:52 interesting thing

about being an attendee versus a

14:51:56

panelist, you can't see who else

is in the room.

You have no idea how many people

14:52:00

are there.

Sometimes when you

14:52:03 are providing

testimony on a

14:52:06 case, you are

supported by a room full of

people who feel the

14:52:09 same way,

and you would not necessarily

know that you have that or

14:52:13 don't

have that.

>> Right.

>> In this forum.

>> That's

14:52:17 all.

I just wanted to say hi.

>> Very nice to

14:52:20 see you,

Hillary.

>> That's

14:52:23 really good.

I think that -- I know

14:52:26 -- I saw

Kara had a few emails

14:52:30 today with

Darren earlier just asking about

14:52:33

that because Megan walker, one

of our planners, mentioned

14:52:36 that,

as

14:52:39 well and.

I am not a tech person

14:52:42 but I

don't see why zoom can't have a

patch that allows

14:52:45 attendees to

see everyone in the room so you

have a sense of

14:52:51 the room before

you go into the room.

Even though you are

14:52:54 listening

the whole time.

I heard Kara asked some

14:52:57 really

good questions of paper, and he

14:53:00

kept coming back hard with maybe

we don't have that option, but

14:53:03

maybe we kick it up a notch.

Kara?

>>

14:53:07 Yeah.

This is a great conversation

because we are

14:53:11 struggling with

it and staff wanting to be, you

14:53:14

know, transparent and provide a

comfortable space for people.

I am

14:53:17 wondering if Julie or

14:53:21

Laura, you know, when we start

testimony or something to

announce like

14:53:25 okay, there is X

amount of people in

14:53:28 the room or

could we do a screen share, or

something to say this is what

14:53:32 it

looks like at this moment, and a

bunch of people will talk.

I don't know.

14:53:37 Just something as a bandaid.

>> You can't screen share

14:53:40 a

zoom, though.

>> You can't?

Okay.

All right.

All

14:53:46 right.

>> Maybe it's an announcement at

the beginning of testimony,

14:53:48 and

then maybe if it's a long list,

you

14:53:51 know, during the middle of

testimony or

14:53:54 something to give a

sense of what's going on out

14:53:59

there.

>> Yes.

>> Julie?

14:54:02 This is

14:54:07 Zari.

Often during hearings and when

people come

14:54:10 and testify, they

bring with

14:54:14 them materials with

them.

How do we get

14:54:17 a chance to read

14:54:20

those if they do come and submit

something?

14:54:23 Do we -- is this

14:54:26 -- are they

required to submit their written

stuff in advance so we

14:54:29 would

have access to them?

How would that

14:54:34 work?

>> Yeah.

My guess is everything

14:54:37 has to be

submitted to the

14:54:42 planner.

>> Julie, but if they have -- so

the moment that they are

14:54:45 making

their presentation, they are

made a panelist, they

14:54:48 can share

their screens and show us their

14:54:51