13:31:16 to roll. 13:31:19 >> So is there a signal that tells us we are live? 13:31:23 >> I just started recording. >> We are recording. >> 13:31:26 Okay. >> Up in the left-hand corner you should see a 13:31:30 "recording" red dot. >> It didn't go on for me. >> Oh, I see 13:31:33 a red flashing bottom line. 13:31:40 Yeah. >> So good afternoon. This is design commission 13:31:44 for Thursday, may 13:31:47 14th, 2020. Please note that the commission hearings 13:31:51 room at 1,900 southwest 4th Avenue, 13:31:55 2,500 B is closed to the public due to 13:31:58 the Covid-19 pandemic. 13:32:01 We are meeting via 13:32:04 zoom for the very first time today. 13:32:07 Under Portland city code and state law the design commission 13:32:10 so holding this meeting electronically. All members of the commission are 13:32:13 attending remotely by video and 13:32:16 tele-conference. Through required public notice the public is invited to also 13:32:19 participate remotely and can provide testimony during today's hearing. 13:32:24 the commission is doing this as a result of the Covid-19 pandemic and the 13:32:27 need to limit in-person 13:32:31 contact and social distances. This is an emergency that threatens 13:32:33 the public health, safety, and welfare which requires us to meet 13:32:37 remotely by electronics communications. Thanks to everyone for 13:32:40 their patience, their flexibility, and 13:32:43 understanding as we manage through this 13:32:47 difficult situation to do our business. As we usually 13:32:50 do, we will begin our hearing today with 13:32:56 introductions. First the bureau of development staff and then Commissioners 13:32:58 who are present, and just to be sure that we are well organized about 13:33:04 this, I propose that each person 13:33:07 introduce themselves, state their position and call on the next 13:33:11 person. So we are going to pass the 13:33:14 baton. We will begin with senior 13:33:17 planner Tim Heron. >> Great. Thank you, Commissioner. This 13:33:20 is Tim Heron, senior planner, bureau of development 13:33:23 services. It is a pleasure to start the 13:33:26 first virtual design commission 13:33:30 Webinar hearing the City of Portland has ever 13:33:34 seen. I will turn my mic off so you don't hear the other things going on in 13:33:37 my home. I will pass the 13:33:41 baton to Kara Fioravanti. 13:33:46 >> Thank you, Tim Heron. This is Kara 13:33:50 Fioravanti. The planner of the design review and historic review 13:33:53 team. I will pass the 13:33:57 baton to 13:34:00 Don Vallaster. >> Oh, that was quick. This is Don 13:34:04 Vallaster, Commissioner on the design 13:34:07 commission, and I will pass it onto Commissioner 13:34:10 Rodriguez. >> This is Sam Rodriguez, 13:34:13 also the design review Commissioner, and I will pass 13:34:16 it onto Zari. >> Zari 13:34:19 Santner, Commissioner, and I pass it 13:34:22 onto Shandra Robinson. >> I am Shandra 13:34:26 Robinson, and I am also a design Commissioner, and I will pass it 13:34:29 onto Commissioner 13:34:33 Molinar. >> Jessica Molinar, design Commissioner, and I will pass 13:34:37 it onto Commissioner McCarter. >> Commissioner 13:34:40 McCarter, Brian McCarter of the Portland design commission, and I will pass 13:34:43 it back to chairman 13:34:48 Livingston. >> This is [inaudible] Livingston, Portland design Commissioner, and chair of the 13:34:51 design commission, and I am going to circle back around to be sure 13:34:54 that 13:34:57 we a few members of staff who are also with us 13:35:00 today beginning with the clerk Laura 13:35:05 DuVall. >> Hi, I'm Laura DuVall, the hearings 13:35:11 clerk. >> And Bryan Tierney. >> Hello, this is Bryan 13:35:16 Tierney, hearings clerk. >> Thank you very 13:35:19 much. And there are a handful of planners with us, today, 13:35:22 first Grace Jeffreys. 13:35:28 >> Sorry, took me a minute to unmute. Good afternoon. It's 13:35:31 great to see all of 13:35:34 you. >> Thanks for joining us, grace. 13:35:38 Stacy Monroe. >> Good afternoon, commission, nice to see you, as 13:35:45 well. >> And Sam 13:35:50 Nelsen. >> Good afternoon, commissioners. It's good to see everyone. 13:35:54 >> Okay. I think that we have captured 13:35:57 all staff, all commissioners. If there is someone who 13:36:01 is not had the opportunity to introduce themselves, for the 13:36:04 record, please raise 13:36:07 your hand on the participants list, and we will circle back around, and 13:36:10 just to be sure, we will be monitoring the 13:36:13 participants' list, 13:36:18 so at any time we may interject. 13:36:21 In fact, the interjections 13:36:24 could come from Laura, Bryan, 13:36:28 or maybe even 13:36:32 me. So commission members, private citizens, appointed by the Mayor 13:36:35 to provide review of new construction or remodeling of 13:36:38 the projects within the design zone. They are not 13:36:42 paid. It is entirely a volunteer. More detailed information regarding the 13:36:45 purpose and function of the commission can be found in the Portland zoning 13:36:50 code. Commission members must declare a conflict of 13:36:53 interest, bias or ex parte contact prior to the 13:36:56 staff presentation. If a commission member has a conflict of 13:36:59 interest or bias, you are not allowed to participate in the commission 13:37:03 discussions or voting on that project. If a commission member has 13:37:06 had an ex parte contact, they must declare the 13:37:09 substance on the record, and it is subject to 13:37:13 rebuttal. So we have is a fairly light agenda today. I 13:37:16 believe that the only item on our agenda is items of 13:37:19 interest, so I am going to 13:37:22 bypass the readings we might have for the 13:37:25 typical land use reviews, and any type of 13:37:29 appeal or other case that might land in front of the 13:37:32 commission. At this point, I think that I will turn it over to Tim 13:37:36 Heron to walk us through items of 13:37:39 interest. >> Awesome. Great. Most 13:37:42 exciting items of interest I have ever had the pleasure 13:37:45 of telling you all 13:37:49 about. I am going to start with just a couple of things. 13:37:52 I wanted to acknowledge Darren 13:37:56 Wegener, who is also here with us -- 13:37:59 at least he was a moment ago. I think he may have stepped 13:38:02 out for another meeting, so I missed the opportunity to say 13:38:06 hi. Darren has been one of the key people behind the 13:38:09 scenes helping us get our tech up and 13:38:13 running. I will circle back and talk with him. He will be present for the next hearings, which we 13:38:16 have next week on the 21st, which will be a 13:38:20 bit more robust than today with a 13:38:23 little more technical gymnastics that we 13:38:26 may need assistance with, but we 13:38:30 hope that he's our training wheels, if you will so after 13:38:34 a couple hearings we hope to take those off, and we will be full scheme 13:38:38 ahead. I wanted to start first by 13:38:41 acknowledging Laura and Bryan Tierney, our 13:38:45 clerks behind the scenes. It's a new 13:38:48 day doing virtual hearings for the clerks. Their job 13:38:51 already is challenging moving the paper 13:38:54 and stuffing the stuff and all the things that you 13:38:57 already know, but the last about a 13:39:01 month and a half preparing for virtual hearings has 13:39:04 been a completely new 13:39:07 animal of tech 13:39:12 management, prehearing management, naming conventions for 13:39:15 how we can see panelists and see 13:39:19 attendees. I could go 13:39:23 on. When I heard of zoom, it was something that I thought my 13:39:26 dog did when she got really excited and ran around the room 13:39:29 really fast. That's how 13:39:32 that might date me a bit, but a lot of staff had to step up 13:39:35 and really move us into this forum, just like all 13:39:38 of you all. I want to acknowledge them and I also want 13:39:42 to acknowledge all of the staff for the design commission 13:39:45 and the historic landmarks commission. The landmarks commission 13:39:48 had a fantastic first hearing on 13:39:52 Monday. Curiously enough it went longer than we 13:39:56 planned. Some of that, I think, frankly had something to do with 13:39:59 it. It was nice to see everyone's faces. So it was a little 13:40:02 social. It was fun. We got business done. It was 13:40:05 great. Hillary did a fantastic job as a liaison for 13:40:09 that. All of us doing it from our different personal 13:40:12 spaces at home. So it's been quite a 13:40:15 journey, so it's really nice to be here. And great to 13:40:18 see your faces. >> You, 13:40:22 too. >> I have -- I am going 13:40:25 to hit -- title all six things, and then I will roll through 13:40:28 them. There is six items of interest. One is 13:40:32 the future. We will talk about that. Two is our 13:40:35 agenda ahead. Looking into the summer. Three is 13:40:38 going to be a quick update on the agenda from 13:40:44 Staci I see Laura is attending, as well. She may participate with that, and 13:40:47 frankly, just questions, wrap-up 13:40:51 , and the Commissioner and I talked before the hearing started about potentially 13:40:54 inviting our attendees if they would like to 13:40:57 help test our systems so to 13:41:01 speak. It would be nice to do that, unless -- in 13:41:03 a less formal setting and to that degree, and then I 13:41:06 would like to end with a 13:41:09 Commissioner zoom meeting screen 13:41:13 shot. Kind of ask you all to say 13:41:17 "cheese," because this is pretty momentous, and I ask first because I 13:41:20 want to give you a chance to 13:41:26 smile. [Laughter] Then I will sneak a screen shot while you are not looking, 13:41:29 so I think that would be an enjoyable way to maybe end 13:41:32 the hearing today. So those are the items. I will 13:41:35 start with the future. Virtual 13:41:38 hearings are our future. Some day I hope 13:41:41 that we get back into 13:41:45 the 2500-a and inhabit the same space 13:41:48 safely, but we don't know when that's going to be right now, as 13:41:51 you all know. What I do know 13:41:54 is already the virtual hearing format we are doing right 13:41:58 now allows access to us by the public in a 13:42:01 way that we have never been available before. 13:42:06 Obviously, it presumes internet access for certain, but the ability 13:42:09 for someone to not have to drive downtown, park, pay for 13:42:12 parking, get to a hearing on-time and testify is 13:42:15 vastly easier with a mobile phone or a laptop computer 13:42:18 through this setting, so I think that it's 13:42:23 fantastic. It raises all kinds of new challenges for us, like I 13:42:26 mentioned, with the effort on Laura and Bryan's part, 13:42:29 setting these things up, but I think we will get that figured out. We are going to 13:42:32 have hiccups. We are going to have trips. We are going to work 13:42:36 it out, and in part because we 13:42:39 have to. If it works out as well as I hope and 13:42:42 what I have been seeing with my own experience with 13:42:45 zoom meetings is I am finding some of these forums -- this 13:42:49 forum actually helps with efficiency. 13:42:52 So I am very optimistic that you are going to 13:42:55 see estimated times for our hearings go down because I think that we are 13:42:58 going to get better at how we do this. I think 13:43:01 the format, itself, lends itself to an 13:43:05 efficiency. But, to that point, I want 13:43:08 to acknowledge something known as zoom fatigue, and that 13:43:11 is really more about not so many zoom, 13:43:14 but it's about this way of communicating and 13:43:18 having so many -- so much visual stimulus through your 13:43:21 screen can be draining. We are being very 13:43:24 mindful in scheduling hearings and specifically, because of 13:43:27 that issue, so what we will 13:43:31 do moving forward is the next -- this is the next topic 13:43:34 -- is work on, as we have always tried to 13:43:37 do, is shorter hearings but potentially 13:43:40 more days so there is a way that we will talk to you all about 13:43:44 that and I hope that's something that might work for you given you are not 13:43:47 commuting into the city. You are also not parking or moving 13:43:50 around and spending that time getting to the hearing room. So that's something 13:43:53 that we will venture on together. Right now my 13:43:57 commute is just down one flight of stairs to the 13:44:00 basement. I miss my bike ride into work, but 13:44:03 man, I have never been at work faster, so it's 13:44:07 an interesting time for me, too. When it comes to 13:44:11 timing, we don't know. We are really following the lead from the 13:44:16 Governor, Kate Brown in terms of how we 13:44:19 reopen, how social distancing is going to work. We, obviously, live in 13:44:22 a city. We hold hearings in a 13:44:25 room. I know we just paid for the dioce we have, and you 13:44:28 are not six feet apart, and I don't think we are getting another 13:44:31 one. So I think that it's going to be some time before we see that 13:44:35 room again. Once, obviously, once the Governor 13:44:38 makes an announcement, we will follow the lead of 13:44:42 the Mayor, Ted 13:44:45 wheeler, and our BDS 13:44:48 director's lead and move forward on how we get back together. I think, though, 13:44:51 it's just an affirmation that we are doing this for a 13:44:55 while. So as you get more comfortable with 13:44:58 the technology, and how you receive the materials and reviewing 13:45:01 them, we are really looking for your feedback. Like what's working. What's 13:45:05 not working. What do you need? What's 13:45:08 missing? And we are going to do everything that we can to 13:45:11 make that smoother, cleaner, and the best that we can 13:45:14 do. So you have seen that already in the guides that we sent 13:45:18 out. Those will, no doubt, be updated. I, 13:45:21 actually, have a couple more updates that we'll do with 13:45:25 those, and I will send that out. I will try and use 13:45:28 a convention, and hillary will be doing the 13:45:31 same with the Landmarks Commission when there 13:45:34 is an update. I will try to make a red print 13:45:37 13:45:40 or yellow board of the document like 13:45:44 okay, version may 13:45:47 14th, 2020 has this update, and it may be something like 13:45:50 Commissioner McCarter has the coolest architectural features in his 13:45:54 backgrounds, so I am going to add that to 13:45:57 the preference. Or Tim's flag behind him needs to 13:46:00 change every week, you know. 13:46:03 [Laughter] Kidding, but I think that that's something that the more we get 13:46:06 familiar, the cleaner the hearings are going to run and 13:46:09 the faster we are going to move forward. So that's 13:46:13 my future in my mind and how we talked about it 13:46:16 internally. Does anyone have any 13:46:20 questions about the 13:46:24 future? >> I just have a thought. Based on 13:46:28 hillary's experience that she says 13:46:31 after two hours she was totally exhausted. I 13:46:34 am wondering if we shouldn't be responding more in 13:46:37 print than forwarding those comments on so that the 13:46:40 hearing would just be sort of a follow-up on the thoughts we already 13:46:43 put forth rather than do 13:46:47 it all in the meeting 13:46:51 format. >> A great question. I think it is a public hearing, so I think 13:46:54 it's really going to be important that the public hear 13:46:58 your words as well as see you. How 13:47:01 you prepare for the hearing, however, could be doubling 13:47:04 down on that, so for instance 13:47:09 having notes prepared that you also forward 13:47:12 is fine, but also even if you are rereading them or 13:47:16 presenting them, I think that's going to be an important part of what we do 13:47:19 as commissioners so that everyone here hears your 13:47:22 thoughts and words, and we get into hearings and we start to compare notes and put 13:47:26 them together and do that thing we call 13:47:29 "deliberation," that we are all kind of contributing and riffing off of each 13:47:33 other. It's going to be a little different because we are all, you 13:47:37 know, tiles on a computer screen, you 13:47:40 know, so there is the nuance there. I am relying on myself, 13:47:43 your words and what I hear, but I am also relying 13:47:46 on what I see in your 13:47:51 expressions. I know some commissioners more than others can read my 13:47:55 facial expressions pretty well in the hearing 13:47:58 room, so I will share those as much as I 13:48:01 can. Although, if you want I am fine and I can just 13:48:04 do this all the time if that's 13:48:07 more helpful, but I know that 13:48:10 Commissioner Jessica always sat a few chairs to my right and really appreciated some 13:48:14 of my expressions, so I will probably be 13:48:17 mindful it's not just her viewing them these 13:48:20 days. Sorry, Jessica. I might be more 13:48:25 filtered. >> I want to respond to Don's suggestion. I 13:48:28 find it very useful 13:48:31 to write things, but one thing 13:48:34 that I really miss in terms of 13:48:37 the DAR that we already 13:48:40 submitted is that in the meetings listening to each 13:48:44 of us we learn from each other quite a bit. Not all of us 13:48:47 have the same kind of 13:48:51 expertise, so I felt that was really 13:48:54 missing. I didn't know how this 13:48:57 was going to be communicated 13:49:01 through the applicant, 13:49:04 to what extent we felt strongly about the opinion that we 13:49:08 were raising, which could be 13:49:11 moderated by listening to each other. So I 13:49:15 think that we may have to modify a lot 13:49:18 of things as we go 13:49:22 along. >> From my standpoint I think 13:49:25 on some of these fairly straightforward 13:49:28 projects, I didn't spend a lot of time pre-meeting going 13:49:31 over in great detail because we pick up a lot of 13:49:34 that during the 13:49:38 presentation. So but I think in this format I am going to have to 13:49:41 prepare more for the meetings than I have in the 13:49:46 past. I think that it's just going to be easier 13:49:49 to communicate on the basis of more familiarity with the 13:49:53 product than we have had to have up to 13:49:56 now. I kind of prefer the actual 13:49:59 meetings we have had significantly, but we 13:50:02 are not in that place at this time, so we will have to 13:50:05 deal with this. >> Maybe it's something that we revisit down 13:50:09 the road if we are finding the deliberation is -- the what 13:50:12 can of deliberation is 13:50:16 really leaving -- not a congealed sort of 13:50:21 design commission direction for the applicants. Maybe we 13:50:25 revisit that we do something like this, do a zoom 13:50:28 meeting to do DARs down the 13:50:31 road. I don't know. I also like the 13:50:36 deliberation because, you know, inevitably Julie knows the 13:50:40 code better, or Jessica knows the code better. It's 13:50:43 just really good to have colleagues remind us 13:50:48 of stuff. While that's fine, but here's what 13:50:51 the code says, you 13:50:55 know. >> That's when the magic happens. It's the 13:50:58 deliberation. For me, personally, that's the part that it's a pleasure to be paid to 13:51:01 be in the room to watch you 13:51:04 deliberate. So I know that we can repeat that in 13:51:07 this virtual format. 13:51:11 Maybe that's a big, strong push. I know I have spoken 13:51:14 with Kara and 13:51:17 other staff, I think that's where a lot can happen. I also see opportunities in 13:51:20 the virtual format moving forward that we have that as 13:51:23 an assist in our hearings. I could see a scenario, 13:51:26 bryans, Bryan, 13:51:29 where the next time you can leave the country, and if you were willing you 13:51:35 could zoom a 13:51:38 meeting, and we could get you anywhere around the world now, and we could set you 13:51:41 a monitor, and you would be there. Your 13:51:44 energy and physicality would be missed, but it would 13:51:48 be almost as good. >> I will say this, 13:51:52 though, that also the flip side is 13:51:55 having the -- for the last DAR that we did, 13:51:58 having the discipline of filling out the matrix is very good for 13:52:02 you. It's a good exercise. It forces you 13:52:05 to flip back and forth between the drawings 13:52:09 and really, you know, kind of get your thoughts organized 13:52:11 and get them down, so it kind of cuts both 13:52:15 ways, but I do miss hearing my colleagues and having 13:52:18 that good kind of back and 13:52:25 forth. >> I agree with that. And I 13:52:28 guess the DAR format seemed -- I think it worked 13:52:31 okay. Tim, you may have a little feedback from 13:52:34 what we all provided, and was that 13:52:38 pretty helpful in informing 13:52:41 the applicant? >> The notes only, 13:52:45 Don? >> Yes. >> I think we are still 13:52:48 putting those packages together, so to be determined. To 13:52:51 your point, though, the deliberation 13:52:57 aspect I think elevated everyone's 13:53:00 responses. I think that's something 13:53:05 where again as we embrace this format, which we are 13:53:08 forced to, I think that I am very 13:53:11 optimistic that we will get better at it. I 13:53:14 am certainly experiencing myself going from zero miles per hour 13:53:18 zoom to 120 miles per hour 13:53:23 zoom. >> And we can get some feedback from staff, too, on how 13:53:26 that first D- 13:53:31 first DAR went. >> Let's have that 13:53:34 conversation soon. >> Yeah. 13:53:37 >> You mean zoom? 13:53:40 >> 13:53:45 Touche. I love saying this, I will say it 13:53:48 again, any other questions about the future? [Laughter] >> Something 13:53:51 -- I don't know if you are going to get to this in the next one -- but something that came up 13:53:54 last week that I was kind of intrigued by is, you 13:53:57 know, I keep my 13:54:01 handy external hard drive here, which has got practically everything 13:54:04 that I know on it, and the 13:54:07 ability if we were having a deliberation and an LUR and 13:54:10 trying to tell somebody about how it's good to 13:54:13 have the awnings at this height and 13:54:17 trans windows above it, you can punch, share 13:54:20 screen, with your commissioners and show them a precedent. Show them exactly what you are talking 13:54:24 about. We can't do that in the live 13:54:27 room in the meetings, so there is kind of an interesting thing there. What we have got to 13:54:31 be careful, though, is that doesn't bog down 13:54:34 and take an inordinate amount of 13:54:37 time. I am intrigued by that, being able to show an example 13:54:40 -- here's what I am talking about. This is what I think the guideline is getting at. >> 13:54:43 That's great, Bryan. We talked about that at one of the 13:54:46 mock hearings when we did our practice sessions with just a couple of 13:54:49 groups of you at a time. That was something that came 13:54:53 up. I have already experienced that nuance of 13:54:56 screen sharing because you had to, but a picture 13:54:59 says a thousand words. >> 13:55:02 Yep. Yep. >> Good. Good. >> Technically is 13:55:05 that pretty hard to do, Bryan? >> What's 13:55:09 that? >> How does one do that? >> You see the menu 13:55:12 down in the center. There is a Green arrow, 13:55:15 "share screen." What it requires you to do, if you think that 13:55:18 you want to make a point about something, have that image 13:55:22 opened and have it parked somewhere where you don't have to go searching for it, 13:55:25 so have anything that's a precedented thing 13:55:28 that's relevant sitting there on our other screen. 13:55:31 Then when your turn comes around to make your 13:55:35 commentary, you can just say, my fellow commissioners, I have 13:55:38 an example of what I am trying to -- what I am 13:55:41 talking about here, and just hit the 13:55:44 "share screen" thing and bring it up. >> Do you 13:55:47 see that at the bottom, 13:55:51 Don? >> It's in Green? Sure. >> I will give you an 13:55:58 example. >> Here, I will do this since I like to be 13:56:01 that guy. Cuz 13:56:06 me? >> Yep. >> So this is a picture of 13:56:11 my space, and we started this as a team. We 13:56:14 are all able to see each other's faces in our backgrounds, 13:56:17 so we started a little, where is your office 13:56:21 now? We miss seeing each other in their spaces. 13:56:24 So 13:56:28 Don, that's a bit of a screen share, a little bit of me 13:56:31 making it work. >> Okay. >> Is that 13:56:35 helpful? >> I 13:56:38 I could pick out the right gauge of metal and pop that up on 13:56:41 the 13:56:45 screen. >> A little replica 13:56:48 activity. >> Something with no oil canning, preferably. >> Yes, 13:56:53 please. Okay. Any more questions about 13:56:56 the future? 13:57:01 Okay. So future related but just 13:57:06 agenda related, and I guess what I will do -- I will do it this 13:57:09 way since I can 13:57:12 screen share the agenda for you 13:57:15 all. I will just talk and open it up. 13:57:18 So everyone, if you don't already, I would 13:57:22 have the agenda hot linked somewhere on our desktop. 13:57:25 Laura and Bryan and behind the 13:57:28 scenes Kara and I and hillary and all the design commission 13:57:32 and staff are constantly hitting this 13:57:35 agenda, and in the last couple weeks, never more than I can ever 13:57:38 remember. A lot of that had to do with updating it 13:57:41 regularly. You can see that Laura was -- or Bryan was in 13:57:45 here just yesterday updating this agenda. This is updated 13:57:49 daily. It's a good resource. We spent a lot of 13:57:52 time in this agenda section here about this 13:57:55 is, obviously, available to the public. Some 13:57:58 things about keeping in mind how we do what 13:58:02 we do. Covid related warnings. Why we 13:58:05 are doing virtual 13:58:08 hearings. But this is where we spent some time and wanted 13:58:11 to make sure the public had resources 13:58:14 on to use this. This is for you all. You have received separate 13:58:18 guides as commissioners which are a little more customized for your role, 13:58:21 but what we also sent you was the guides that we have made 13:58:25 for staff that we have made for 13:58:29 the public, and that we have made for the applicant. We will be updating those 13:58:32 probably weekly as we go forward through some hearings and tweaking 13:58:36 things. Know that this is something that we really spent some time 13:58:39 on to kind of help the public navigate this, as well. 13:58:42 One thing we realized quickly is 13:58:45 we don't know what everyone's individual 13:58:48 setup is at home and what they are seeing or how many screens 13:58:51 that they are using or their 13:58:54 capability with the software. So, we are doing the best that we can to 13:58:57 make that information available for people 13:59:01 to participate from their mobile device or from their 13:59:06 laptop. What you will also see here is this is a 13:59:10 Webinar registration link that Laura sets up. These will appear 13:59:13 for hearings about 13:59:16 two weeks before the hearing. The reason why we do it two weeks before 13:59:19 is we want to make sure we have all the information we need. 13:59:23 These links to these hearings, you receive 13:59:26 separate ones individually. You are specifically 13:59:29 invited as commissioners. As you know, and you are all here, so you 13:59:32 have obviously done it correctly, but what the public will 13:59:36 see is this link, and anyone that views this web Page can click 13:59:39 this link and register and 13:59:42 participate. What you will have here is a list of attendees 13:59:45 that are in the hearing room. If you go to 13:59:48 your participants panel at the bottom of 13:59:52 the screen, float over 13:59:55 it, you can click and see people that are 13:59:58 here 14:00:01 listening, probably various to see how their hearings are going to go next week. I think 14:00:04 it's great. I see some familiar names right now. We are going to 14:00:08 invite anyone that wants to, to 14:00:11 speak, as well, a little later. Chair 14:00:14 Julie and I talked about that, to get that experience for you 14:00:18 all. As you roll through, obviously, we are wrapping 14:00:21 up some notes to you, and then we are also 14:00:24 looking at the next -- the hearing for the next 14:00:28 week, which is full. We will 14:00:31 be busy, but it's one where we are looking forward to managing 14:00:34 well and getting through all the technical -- 14:00:37 and hopefully no technical 14:00:41 hurdles. >> So 14:00:44 Tim, you will be [INAUDIBLE] >> I am sorry, say that again? >> Will 14:00:47 you be forwarding these to us by an 14:00:50 email? >> Yes. >> I think he already did. >> You should have already 14:00:56 gotten it, 14:01:00 Don. So what you will also get is -- Laura will 14:01:03 put together a poll for extra dates in July, 14:01:06 August, and 14:01:09 September. We are digging out a bit from the hiatus that 14:01:12 we were on, but note that 14:01:16 those dates that we are pulling for are really an opportunity for 14:01:19 us to shorten the hearing 14:01:22 lengths. I know you already knew the hearings are long. Sometimes we 14:01:25 have them in the hearing room. But 14:01:28 we mentioned about the fatigue of video 14:01:31 meetings. I think it's going to be more important not only that we 14:01:34 learn the platform and are more efficient with it, but that we 14:01:38 also have maybe stretched them out over the 14:01:41 month. When Laura sends that out, you know, please let us know when you 14:01:44 are available. We are not going to pick every Thursday 14:01:47 between here and September, but we do want to have 14:01:50 the flexibility to move some hearings around 14:01:53 so we don't have so long of a day, for 14:01:57 instance, as we might have on the 14:02:00 21st. So that really kind of represents more clearing the logjam. 14:02:03 It's not the new normal. We need to have 14:02:06 some flexibility on 14:02:13 dates. >> Tim, because of everything going 14:02:17 on, I don't know about everyone else's situation, but at least 14:02:21 mine, I don't know, actually, what's going to happen this summer or in the 14:02:24 fall. I can give you dates that maybe will be open, but 14:02:28 then could disappear the week before or two weeks 14:02:32 before. I just don't know. >> Jessica, 14:02:35 totally get it. I have got 14:02:38 one young kid, and the whole world 14:02:41 is upside down with no summer camps this summer, so we 14:02:45 are still figuring it out. All my vacation plans are 14:02:49 tentative or blew up, you know. So I hear you. 14:02:52 Definitely aware of that, we are working that out internally, as I imagine 14:02:55 many people are. But 14:02:58 again, I am optimistic that short of 14:03:01 not having to go downtown for a 14:03:05 hearing, that we cut the commute time out of the effort 14:03:08 to host these things. We had 14:03:11 even had a little discussion about potentially thinking about hearing 14:03:15 dates on different of different days of the week, 14:03:18 potentially. Is there a nuance of maybe getting off of 14:03:21 Thursdays for a DAR or something 14:03:24 else. I think it's wide open. We want to make 14:03:27 it easier for everyone and not have 14:03:30 long video conferences on Thursday 14:03:34 afternoons, but scheduling is challenging, especially with younger 14:03:39 kids. I get 14:03:42 that. >> Okay. >> Any questions on 14:03:47 that? >> I have a question. We were just looking at the 14:03:50 agenda, which is very easy to find and has all the 14:03:53 links. I have used it many times. It's great. But seeing 14:03:57 that we have a hearing on the 21st, I am looking through 14:04:01 my email, and I don't have it on my 14:04:04 calendar. I am available and I will be there, but 14:04:07 -- or I will be here in my space right now, but I don't see 14:04:10 it on my calendar yet so I wanted to check 14:04:13 if it was on there and I missed it. >> Is everyone 14:04:17 tracking that -- maybe Laura or Bryan, maybe we 14:04:20 could spend another heads up to 14:04:23 Shandra. >> Me, as well because for 14:04:27 whatever reason not all meeting requests are 14:04:31 landing. >> That one is not an actual meeting, right? It is your 14:04:35 DAR comments are due? >> DAR 14:04:38 comments, I believe, are due on Wednesday. We actually have 14:04:41 hearings on Thursday. >> You know, I just looked on my 14:04:45 outlook, and of course I am usually screwed up on 14:04:48 that, but I don't have that invite, either. >> Neither do 14:04:52 I. >> Okay. >> Can I ask a 14:04:56 question? When you are invited to the Webinar, you have an option to 14:04:59 put that on our calendar, and then it saves 14:05:03 the link, your personal 14:05:06 invite to the hearing. If I send you 14:05:09 an outlook invite, you will have two items on 14:05:12 there. Not to be confused. I can send an outlook invite 14:05:15 so you have -- one you put on with the link and one from 14:05:19 us. What would you all prefer? >> Sorry, 14:05:22 Laura, I think you tried to explain this last time when we were testing 14:05:25 this out. I got it 14:05:30 figured out but only for the meeting today, and I didn't get it figured 14:05:33 out for the meeting next week, so maybe I just need to look. >> You 14:05:36 should get a reminder today. You will get a week 14:05:39 and day and hour reminder for next week's 14:05:42 hearing. Those are all -- every time you get that you will have the 14:05:46 opportunity to add it to your 14:05:51 calendar. Do you want that? Or would you like 14:05:54 an outlook invite? I don't 14:05:57 want to clog up your calendar with too many things of the 14:06:00 same 14:06:04 sort. >> I am looking through the hearings clerk emails, and they 14:06:07 are all for the 14th, or so it 14:06:13 seems. I went through several, the weekly, the 14:06:16 day, the hour before, but I don't have the one for 14:06:19 the 21st. >> I think it would be really helpful to just 14:06:22 get it in an outlook invite. That 14:06:27 way I know -- that way I can just go to the calendar and click on the link 14:06:30 and I am good. I don't need to go back through the emails and 14:06:34 look. >> Don't mistake the invite, though, to have your personal invite 14:06:38 link. I can't do that -- >> 14:06:43 Oh! We have personal ones. >> Yeah, yeah. >> What is 14:06:46 the first method for getting this 14:06:49 again? [Laughter] >> Okay. When I create a 14:06:53 Webinar, I have an option to invite 14:06:57 panelists. >> Can I jump in? >> Yeah. >> One of the problems 14:07:01 is that all of us have an 14:07:04 outlook invite on our calendars for 14:07:07 Thursdays that are regular meetings. But whether we 14:07:10 would have them or not have them, you know, it's been put 14:07:13 in there for a long 14:07:17 time. Is it possible to -- personally, I 14:07:21 cannot remove it unless, you know, I 14:07:24 removed all of it. Is it possible to 14:07:27 remove those and then 14:07:30 just having the zoom invite, so we can click and put 14:07:33 it in our calendar. No? >> I can 14:07:36 certainly remove that automatic outlook 14:07:40 invite. It just reminded you to watch every 14:07:43 Thursday -- yeah. That does not sound like that's what 14:07:46 the majorities of the commissioners want. They 14:07:49 also want reminders. >> They want both of them. Okay. >> 14:07:55 Yeah. I think we need a consensus. I don't want to 14:07:58 do it for some and differently for others. It will be super confusing 14:08:01 and tasking. >> I 14:08:04 think if we have both, it just sits 14:08:07 side-by-side in your outlook calendar, but I swear I don't have the 14:08:11 one for the 21. >> Me, either. >> It's not 14:08:14 there. >> But so just 14:08:17 so that I have this straight, so the outlook calendar always is 14:08:20 going to be independent of our zoom link because you cannot 14:08:23 send out individual ones to everybody with that particular 14:08:26 meeting, zoom link because you don't have that. So 14:08:29 either way the calendar will notify us of the time and 14:08:32 day, but we still need to find that email from the 14:08:37 hearings clerk from, you know, that is the latest that gives 14:08:40 us our personal link because we are signed in as a 14:08:44 Webinar, not just as a regular zoom meeting. >> You 14:08:47 live in your calendar, if you just add it. It has an option. >> If we 14:08:50 add it, right, yes. Yes. >> They are 14:08:54 side-by-side. You just open the one that's the zoom one, and 14:08:57 it has the link 14:09:01 automatically. It can sit side-by-side. >> Even if you 14:09:05 don't save the first time you get invited, you will get 14:09:08 the weak reminder, you will have that option. You will have 14:09:11 the day and the hour before so any of those points 14:09:14 -- if you just watch for that, you will be able to 14:09:18 click on the link and attend the hearing. >> That's 14:09:21 awesome. I did not see that link. That's fantastic. I would prefer 14:09:24 to not -- >> Could somebody share a screen and show 14:09:29 us what you are -- >> I can do it. Hold on. >> That's 14:09:32 fantastic. I would prefer for you to not send me 14:09:35 a calendar link because you are right, we will have 14:09:38 duplicates. >> Right, right. >> This is the invitation she 14:09:42 sends -- Laura sends. It says, "add to 14:09:45 calendar." >> We can't see your screen yet. >> Oh, sorry. Hold on. 14:09:50 Share. There we 14:09:53 go. Can you see it now? >> There you go. Perfect. >> 14:09:56 So you see how she sends this. This is for the 14:10:02 14th. You can just join it, but you can also just add it to 14:10:06 your calendar. >> That's awesome. >> Okay. >> If it's 14:10:09 a Yahoo calendar -- but this is added to 14:10:12 your outlook calendar. >> Thank you, Tim. >> So 14:10:15 maybe -- that's great. Thank you. This is great, everyone. 14:10:20 Progress. Maybe we could side bar it. Just so you all know one of the 14:10:23 reasons we send out the 14:10:28 outlook calendar is it alerts the infrastructure bureaus of 14:10:31 a hearing date via that outlook 14:10:36 link. Maybe, Laura, at 14:10:40 our next meeting we could figure out if commissioners prefer 14:10:43 -- if you want to make the zoom 14:10:46 Webinar email the only one you get from the 14:10:50 clerks, we could possibly do that, and you do what you need to do and add 14:10:53 it to your respective calendars. >> I am going to 14:10:57 show this. Here's how it sits 14:11:01 side-by-side. >> That's just like mine. >> This is the outlook one. >> 14:11:08 Yep. >> If I need to, if I want to go to this one this 14:11:11 is where I connect it to. >> Yep. >> The other one 14:11:18 is just the regular agenda link that we get sent 14:11:21 by Laura, so we can just live together. >> I like 14:11:24 that. I like that because I like being able to look out a month in 14:11:27 advance and see what Thursdays are 14:11:30 locked down. >> 14:11:33 That's a good 14:11:36 point. >> If you wanted to, Bryan, you could lock down you are a your 14:11:39 Thursdays. [Laughter] >> Wait a minute, I've been locked down to two 14:11:42 months now. 14:11:48 [Laughter] >> Okay. >> See the handcuffs? No. 14:11:51 [Laughter] >> Good huddle. Thank you, Laura, for clarifying 14:11:55 that. Is that more helpful for everyone? >> It sounds like 14:11:58 we do want the outlook calendar? >> 14:12:01 Yeah, let's side bar on it. I want to 14:12:04 circle back with Kara and the seniors. I guess my thought 14:12:08 was maybe we could avoid sending the outlook one 14:12:11 to commissioners but send the invite to staff and 14:12:14 the bureaus, but let's huddle on 14:12:17 that and decide something moving forward. 14:12:21 Does that sound cool, Laura? >> Yeah. >> Right 14:12:24 on. >> I kind of thought that the system you have right now 14:12:28 works great -- pretty well for me. I get the notice the day in 14:12:31 advance, and I just click on it. >> That's all 14:12:34 Laura. That's great. The zoom meeting -- having those reminders with 14:12:37 the zoom like a week, day, and 14:12:40 hour before -- we are all for it. We will keep that for sure. >> Thank 14:12:43 you, Laura. >> Yeah, thank 14:12:47 you. >> She's the zoom master. >> Not 14:12:53 really. [Laughter] >> 14:12:56 Okay. So three more items on the agenda really quick. I am going to 14:13:00 -- it will be DOZA questions and a zoom 14:13:03 meeting snapshot, but I want to take a chance with questions 14:13:06 and invite some attendees up to 14:13:10 testify if you will. But let's get through 14:13:14 DOZA. Staci, you are here, and Laura is here, 14:13:17 too. Thank you for coming, Laura Do you want to 14:13:20 do a quick 14:13:23 DOZA update? >> 14:13:27 Yes. [Laughter] Give me one 14:13:31 second. Okay. Hello. I 14:13:34 sent all of you an email 14:13:38 yesterday providing a brief time line about the next 14:13:41 steps of 14:13:44 DOZA I put that on a sheet -- or a presentation that I would like to share with 14:13:47 you. 14:13:56 It's right here. Cuz 14:14:00 Can you see my screen? There we go. 14:14:05 Okay. So it's been quiet for 14:14:08 a while. I wanted to bring you up to speed on 14:14:11 DOZA because it will be going full speed ahead starting next 14:14:15 week. So next week you will be receiving 14:14:21 packets with the amendments from 14:14:24 BPS that reflect the prior discussions at work 14:14:27 sessions that you've been 14:14:30 conducting I think since last 14:14:33 October of 2019. All of that 14:14:37 hard work has been folded into a 14:14:40 revised document, so you should be receiving that next 14:14:45 week. Next Thursday Laura will be attending 14:14:48 from BPS, and she is just going to brief 14:14:51 the commission on a really high level overview of 14:14:54 the amendments and give you specific instructions about how to 14:14:57 review the documents and provide comments to 14:15:02 her for discussion on June 4th. So you will have 14:15:05 two weeks between May 14:15:08 19th and June 4th to comb through those revisions 14:15:11 and make sure that they reflect 14:15:14 your prior discussion and comments from the past year or 14:15:19 so. Again, next week Laura will just be giving a 14:15:22 high level overview in order 14:15:25 to make June 4th be a very efficient 14:15:28 hearing. She will give you specific instructions on how to 14:15:31 provide any comments. So I will get into the first hearing, it will 14:15:34 be June 4th. That's when 14:15:37 you, as commissioners, will bring any of your comments or 14:15:41 edits for discussion at that 14:15:46 hearing. If they are all minor changes, meaning you 14:15:49 can easily dictate 14:15:53 the edits to Laura, it's possible that you could 14:15:55 actually vote on our recommendation to the city council on 14:15:59 June 4th. That's the hope. If there are 14:16:02 more significant amendments that requires 14:16:05 BPS to, actually, fine tune the language and bring it back to the 14:16:10 commission, we will be returning on 14:16:13 June 18th for hopefully the 14:16:17 final hearing why Laura will present any revised or amended 14:16:20 language that you requested from the prior 14:16:24 hearing. If the vote doesn't occur on June 4th, that would be 14:16:27 the date that you would be voting on a recommendation to city 14:16:32 council. On July 16th the 14:16:36 Macadam character statements, which will be the first adapted 14:16:39 character statement for the new design guidelines, will be 14:16:42 coming to the design commission. This will be 14:16:45 a public hearing. You are the recommending 14:16:49 body for the first character 14:16:52 statement to the city 14:16:55 council. I believe at this hearing, again, this will be a public hearing on 14:16:58 a legislative project, so the public will be 14:17:01 providing testimony, and the PSC might also be 14:17:04 providing their testimony on the character 14:17:09 statement. So that's kind of what 14:17:12 DOZA looks like. 14:17:15 While it's in your courted, we are 14:17:19 court, we are not sure of the next step when it goes to council. There is other 14:17:22 pressing stuff council is working on, the hope is to still have it go before 14:17:25 council for 14:17:29 adoption this year, but I am sure that Laura can provide you an update 14:17:32 with that at the hearing next week. 14:17:36 Does anyone have any questions about what to expect for the 14:17:40 next month or so for DOZA? >> 14:17:43 Is the June 18th and July 16th 14:17:46 written testimony from 14:17:50 us? >> It's not testimony. June 18th will be an opportunity 14:17:53 for you to review any 14:17:57 revised language you request of Laura, or BPS, from the 14:18:00 June 4th 14:18:04 hearing. >> And then there is a vote. >> Correct. >> 14:18:07 And again, you are a recommending body so you will 14:18:10 be voting on a recommendation to city council. 14:18:13 The same is true for the 14:18:19 July 16th. Any other questions? 14:18:23 Laura, you are also here. Do you have anything to add? 14:18:27 >> I don't think that I have anything to 14:18:30 add. Good to see your faces, and I look forward 14:18:33 to talking with you next week. 14:18:39 >> We also have a 3-by-3 on the calendar tomorrow, 14:18:42 though, right? That's still happening? >> Correct. >> Okay. 14:18:46 Great. >> I have a 14:18:51 question. So this is 14:18:54 in general. We are moving ahead 14:18:57 with this 14:19:01 DOZA implementation as if Covid has not 14:19:05 happened. Covid happened, and 14:19:08 it's going to have massive 14:19:12 ramifications in terms of the development and urban design 14:19:16 and everything. Has the 14:19:19 bureau of planning and sustainability and BDS even thought 14:19:24 about what the ramification of the future 14:19:28 changes will 14:19:33 be on these 14:19:36 guidelines, and whether we just forge 14:19:41 ahead and then if the fog 14:19:45 lifts, then if needed we do another amendment. I just 14:19:48 wanted to put that out 14:19:52 there. >> I will speak for BDS. We have not had 14:19:55 the conversation about how this -- how 14:19:58 the current times impact all this work, but I think that we believe that 14:20:01 there's been so much effort, gosh, 14:20:04 four years or so, five years put into this document into 14:20:07 all this work that the plan is to forge 14:20:10 ahead because this is not about a short-term 14:20:13 solution. This is about the city's 14:20:17 future. BPS could have had other conversations. I am 14:20:20 not sure. Laura if you want to share anything or have anything to 14:20:24 share? >> 14:20:27 I was muted. This is certainly not a five-minute 14:20:32 conversation. I've been thinking about this a lot because so much 14:20:35 of what we have written and talked about and championed 14:20:38 together is about social interaction 14:20:42 and gathering and the ability for people of all 14:20:45 different backgrounds to 14:20:51 impromptu meet. How do we make that work in the 14:20:54 city, and how do we make the city, you know, 14:20:57 the best space -- provide the best 14:21:01 spaces in the future. I still think -- I've been 14:21:04 reading over the document and thinking about this -- I 14:21:08 still think a lot of what we have 14:21:11 said and talked about together still 14:21:14 holds true. I think it's even more important for 14:21:18 us to champion the diversity of public spaces 14:21:21 and make sure that there 14:21:24 is ample room for people to 14:21:28 move about and champion people's access 14:21:31 to light and 14:21:34 air and balconies and welcoming sprees 14:21:40 entrys and things like that. I don't know that there is a lot of huge changes in the 14:21:43 guidelines, but I think that I would put this back to you and use 14:21:46 this as a 14:21:50 lens to think about how our guidelines can remain 14:21:54 timeless in this moment, but also, hopefully as we 14:21:59 get back to -- I don't want to be cliche in saying a new 14:22:02 normal, but I am not sure what else, you know, 14:22:05 our future, our better future together -- >> I 14:22:08 would like to chime in on 14:22:13 that. There is going to be a vaccine at some 14:22:16 point. This particular event is -- 14:22:19 are we expecting to have a virus every two years and have this 14:22:22 be a consistent event over the years? We hope not. We hope this 14:22:25 is a 100-year event, like 14:22:28 the pandemic like the Spanish 14:22:31 flu 14:22:36 of 19 -- yeah, 1718. It was two years of that. 14:22:39 The science wasn't there to get us where we possibly could get 14:22:43 here. We've been having these discussions 14:22:46 internally, as a business. 14:22:49 We build, buildings for people. We build buildings 14:22:52 where people interact and amenity spaces and ground floors and 14:22:55 what have you. I think that this is going to 14:23:00 be incredibly painful of a period where there is going to be a lot of, you 14:23:03 know, where we are reacting to a lot of things, but I think we are going to 14:23:07 get through this at some point. There will be a vaccine. 14:23:10 There will be an 14:23:13 immunity, a combination of one and the other, and eventually there will 14:23:16 be a pentup demand to 14:23:19 go out and meet people and be with 14:23:22 people and have interactive interactions with 14:23:27 people. In terms of the design review, one of the things that I 14:23:30 see is you are crazy if you think you are going to 14:23:33 lease some retail today. So our 14:23:36 active ground floors will be really not very active for a long 14:23:39 time until -- well, a long time. It could be 18 14:23:43 months before we can go to a restaurant on a regular 14:23:46 basis. The Governor just issued, you know, what is 14:23:52 phase one opening where you can have a restaurant with ten people in it as long as they 14:23:55 can keep six feet 14:23:59 apart. Who is going to want to go to that? There will be restaurant 14:24:02 and store failures and all sorts 14:24:05 of disruptions. That said, we are not 14:24:09 redesigning buildings, you know, for example, we are 14:24:12 not redesigning buildings to have a little home office because we think that we 14:24:15 all are going to be working out of our home 14:24:18 office or our bedrooms or 14:24:21 whatever. I think eventually the new normal might be 14:24:24 a combination of materials 14:24:27 that are needed to clean spaces or 14:24:30 to maintain, but eventually, we will all 14:24:34 be back to a certain degree of togetherness because we are human 14:24:37 beings. Frankly, I think everybody 14:24:40 is already suffering from you know, the cabin fever. It's 14:24:43 true. If you don't leave your house, you will go 14:24:49 crazy. You will probably strangle our kids, you know, something 14:24:52 of that nature because there comes a point that we need to be 14:24:55 interactive. So what I am saying is I 14:25:00 think that the outcome of 14:25:04 DOZA is -- might look out of place, but we will be 14:25:07 in place once this 14:25:10 is over, and I shut my mouth. >> One other thing that's 14:25:14 going on where there is a group of 14:25:18 us, there is a number of cities that are changing the use of the public 14:25:21 right-of-ways, kicking cars out and 14:25:25 taking over street space for new-found public open 14:25:28 space. I read something in Cincinnati is now 14:25:31 has closed some streets to traffic so restaurants can have 14:25:34 more seating outdoors where you have got fresh air 14:25:37 movement and you can spread the tables out and stuff like that. 14:25:40 Some of these cities are saying that we're not going to reopen 14:25:44 these streets to cars, so there could 14:25:47 be something -- I don't know how directly this 14:25:51 relates to DOZA because it gets into the realm of 14:25:54 p 14:25:58 PBOT, but it's a trend that we are keeping our eyes on, 14:26:01 reimagining and repurposing of public right of ways for public 14:26:06 space. That could have 14:26:09 an indirect effect on how we look at projects. 14:26:12 >> Well, I didn't want to open the pandora's box 14:26:18 here. But, I just want to make 14:26:21 sure that -- Sam, I agree with you that 14:26:25 Covid may be is a year or two issue, but 14:26:28 it's what this has illuminated 14:26:31 is that what happens in the case of a 14:26:34 major catastrophe, how people behave, what their 14:26:37 needs are. Those are, you know, people's 14:26:40 needs, either social interaction, the need 14:26:44 for social interaction. The need for being away from each 14:26:47 other -- they all have 14:26:50 ramification on the design, and especially in the public realm. 14:26:53 My 14:26:57 question was if this is not the time to answer those 14:27:03 questions, would we be prepared to be 14:27:10 flexible and modify things to be 14:27:14 responsive to the changes. >> I hear you. I think that it's 14:27:17 a valid -- it's a super important 14:27:20 question. I just -- the nature 14:27:23 of this is so unique that you can't 14:27:26 be next to anybody else. >> 14:27:30 Right. >> This is what we are trying to 14:27:34 do, so I don't 14:27:37 see that -- anyway. >> I think you are right, Sam. I think it's too early. 14:27:40 We are going to see and 14:27:43 know more as this plays out over the next year 14:27:46 about how we -- if we need to adjust and how we 14:27:50 adjust. >> Yeah. >> I have a fear 14:27:53 that retail is going to 14:27:57 be probably further hurt by the -- by this 14:28:00 virus, and we're never going to go back to streets as 14:28:04 busy as we have known them before the virus 14:28:09 hit. I think that there is going to be more and more people used to ordering 14:28:12 stuff on Amazon, 14:28:17 Etc. Retail has already been struggling, and I think it will 14:28:21 be -- essentially, it will be exacerbated. >> Have 14:28:24 I told you how good I have gotten at folding up 14:28:27 cardboard boxes and filling my recycling bin 14:28:30 every week? [Laughter] 14:28:36 God! Because of all the stuff that comes to the door. >> And you have probably gotten 14:28:39 used to it, and are you going to go back and shop? >> I know. I 14:28:43 know. >> Are you ever going back? So that 14:28:46 impacts the ground floors of buildings, and what do we do 14:28:50 with all of this space. That's a 14:28:54 discussion that warrants, I guess, more 14:28:57 review going forth. 14:29:01 Currently, we require a lot of retail on the ground floor, 14:29:04 and we might never see a lot of those get 14:29:07 occupied. >> 14:29:11 Right. >> I have a really dumb question 14:29:14 about DOZA for 14:29:17 Staci and Laura. The packets 14:29:21 with amendments that are going 14:29:24 to arrive in the 14:29:27 commissioners' hands on the 19th, are those hard copy packets or 14:29:30 electronic packets? >> Those are hard copy packets. I 14:29:33 was just going to bring that 14:29:39 up. So I've been in touch with Laura, and she has provided the 14:29:43 addresses for the courier to get -- it's going to go 14:29:46 straight from the printer to 14:29:50 your designated addresses. I am told the couriers will 14:29:53 just ring a doorbell or knock on a door. They are not going to wait for 14:29:56 anybody to answer. 14:30:01 Know that they are coming straight from the printer. They 14:30:04 will be color copies, but we will 14:30:07 also provide a -- we will also 14:30:10 send you a PDF, as 14:30:14 well. >> Did I answer your question? >> Thank you very much. >> 14:30:17 So -- and the amendments, just to remind you, 14:30:19 it's going to look like the proposed draft. It's a 14:30:23 revised proposed draft. 14:30:26 So it will be -- what are your 14:30:30 revisions look like in the document. The changes will 14:30:34 be highlighted, so you will see what's changed since the proposed 14:30:38 draft. I don't know what -- if commissioners 14:30:41 were able to take 14:30:45 their proposed drafts with them, so I don't know if you have those 14:30:48 hard copies with you? I don't know if you have the table of 14:30:51 amendments with you? We 14:30:54 can provide links to those in case you need 14:30:57 a cross-reference. >> Okay. Thank you very 14:31:00 much, Laura. >> Sure. 14:31:08 >> I just had a quick question for 14:31:13 Tim, if he's still there? >> Oh, Don, I am always 14:31:19 here. >> It's your house. I have to admit, I did get 14:31:22 a warning, my internet is 14:31:25 unstable, so don't take it personally. >> Have you seen 14:31:29 people pulling projects from the queue 14:31:33 because of the virus and the implications of that 14:31:36 for long-term 14:31:39 development? >> I have seen some sliding around 14:31:42 or holdings. Not so much off the 14:31:45 queue. I don't have a full 14:31:48 grasp of the numbers right now. It's 14:31:55 slower. >> We knew that was going to happen, but I was just curious if 14:31:58 things are really falling off a cliff or things 14:32:01 are still -- >> No, we have seen some projects that are 14:32:05 forecasted out like looking into the fall like the 14:32:09 PCs, decent sized projects, enough to be excited. I think 14:32:12 that's part of our resolve here 14:32:15 today moving forward is the show that we could do this 14:32:18 -- to show that we could do this work. I could go 14:32:21 on and on about the stuff that I am hearing 14:32:24 and seeing behind the scenes with everyone working 14:32:27 remotely at the drop of a hat and how the 14:32:30 bureau is rallying to support the staff and get 14:32:34 equipment out and get technology out and get us 14:32:37 ramped up to do this thing. Given the 14:32:42 summer ahead, and it's -- we have to do 14:32:49 it. >> Okay. >> That's what you get from me, Don. >> 14:32:54 Okay. The development community is getting pretty nervous about what the 14:32:57 economy is going to look like in a couple of years, and 14:33:00 therefore, delaying or 14:33:03 suspending the projects. >> I know one developer 14:33:06 that's in this virtual hearing room that might offer some thoughts. I don't 14:33:09 know, Sam, do you want to -- >> 14:33:13 Sure. I can give you an opinion on it. I think at this point everybody is 14:33:16 trying to -- again, it's a 14:33:20 very turbulent 14:33:23 time with muddy waters where we cannot really see where things 14:33:26 are going. In general, the financial 14:33:30 markets are also in a world that they 14:33:33 don't understand. None of us do. The way I like to 14:33:36 put it is just think of this as you had a board 14:33:39 game and you knew where all the pieces were, and 14:33:42 someone scrambled it, and now you have to figure out where the pieces are now 14:33:45 because they are in different places, and people have taken 14:33:48 different attitudes. The banks are pretty much 14:33:52 frozen right now even though there is tons of 14:33:57 liquidity. Basically, they don't know what to lend 14:34:00 to, what are the terms, and when they are giving you terms, the 14:34:03 terms that are so obnoxious that you cannot accept 14:34:09 them. So the investors 14:34:12 community -- there are a lot of these that are pension funds and so 14:34:15 forth which took a beating in the stock market 14:34:19 initially or still. So they are all, 14:34:22 you know, asking for their money, and having redemptions that they 14:34:25 need to deal with, so -- 14:34:28 the same with the insurance companies. So they are pretty 14:34:32 much frozen. Everybody -- the 14:34:35 mantra is extend, extend, extend. Don't 14:34:38 commit any new dollars to 14:34:42 anything just see if you can start the projects in three, 14:34:45 four, five, six months. In general what I 14:34:48 am assuming you will see is that the same thing 14:34:51 is happening if it was close to a good 14:34:55 stopping point, people just go out to that point and stop and are waiting to see 14:34:59 if they can hold on to their land. They are asking for extensions 14:35:02 from sellers if there is the option. 14:35:05 The other thing that's happening is that there is a 14:35:08 general expectation that the construction costs are going to go down, which hasn't 14:35:13 happened. It's too short of a period. We saw some 14:35:17 of that happen. The great recession. 14:35:20 It took a long time before that 14:35:23 happened. Materials, wood prices went down so everybody was expecting that to 14:35:27 sort of -- the Mills stopped working anyway, so the 14:35:30 supply just kind of, you know, 14:35:34 dwindled. So it's a very, very 14:35:37 fluid, incredibly unstable 14:35:42 market. Restaurants are not getting their workers back even if they are able 14:35:45 to open. If they are able to open with ten 14:35:48 people, does it make sense to open at all, so it's such 14:35:52 a -- retail, what is the retail value of -- what is the 14:35:55 value of retail 14:35:58 from an investor perspective. It's so jumbled 14:36:01 up that nobody knows whether it's up or down or left or right, 14:36:04 and everybody is trying to find 14:36:08 that. What I would envision would happen for the design review 14:36:12 perspective is everybody is just saying hold off. I am not going to do this right 14:36:18 now. You will see a trickle of projects that might start 14:36:21 getting, you know, 14:36:24 financing or investors or, you know, the 14:36:27 construction cost starts to make sense. But rents are going 14:36:30 down so from a residential perspective, 14:36:33 projects make less sense than they did, I 14:36:37 mean, already very thin projects that made 14:36:40 some sense two months ago, don't make any 14:36:43 sense right now. >> 14:36:46 Okay. >> My expectation is we are going to be in a slump for a couple 14:36:50 of years. Then things will probably 14:36:53 pick up maybe 2002, 2003, or 14:36:56 something like that. So the 14:37:01 workload will be less for the design commission for the next 14:37:07 couple years. The workload that we had 14:37:11 in 2015, 2016, 2017, is really intense. So many 14:37:14 projects. I would expect that to drop by half or three quarters for the 14:37:17 next year or 14:37:22 two. >> Time will tell. >> 14:37:27 Yeah. >> If any other DOZA related 14:37:30 questions, commissioners? I want to 14:37:34 keep -- I don't want 14:37:37 to keep Staci or Laura any longer than they 14:37:40 might want to stay. >> Even though she's away from her 14:37:43 kids, she's probably 14:37:47 grateful. [Laughter] >> Thank you for your time, and I will see 14:37:50 you at the hearing next Thursday. Let me know if you have any 14:37:54 questions. >> Great. Thank you. >> Thanks. >> Thanks. >> 14:37:57 Thanks, Laura. Thank you for coming on. >> Thank you, 14:38:00 Laura. >> That's 14:38:04 great. So chair Julie -- I had two 14:38:07 things on the items of interest left, and that would be 14:38:11 questions of commissioners -- we have had a bunch of 14:38:14 questions that covered quite a bit already, and then the last 14:38:18 item was -- and Hillary offered, if 14:38:21 I can get her to do it, we can do a zoom 14:38:24 first commission hearing 14:38:28 screen shot when you are ready for it. 14:38:32 if you are all willing. That's really all that I 14:38:35 had planned. Are there other things that you would like to talk 14:38:39 about -- yes, Commissioner. >> Really 14:38:42 briefly on zoom meeting room protocols, I think that we 14:38:45 are closed captioned. >> Yes. >> Yes. Laura -- >> 14:38:48 Does that change how we 14:38:51 -- does that change 14:38:54 what -- how we want to present ourselves? Do we always want 14:38:57 to introduce ourselves? >> Yes, 14:39:01 yes. >> Yeah. >> Yes. Thank you. >> Okay. >> 14:39:05 Yeah. I might have otherwise led with that. You 14:39:08 are correct. With closed captioning 14:39:11 -- and I can obviously see your faces, and I know the sound 14:39:14 of all your voices, but someone 14:39:17 landing into a room that is 14:39:20 either hearing or sight impaired, the closed 14:39:23 captioning provides that 14:39:29 option. Go ahead, Julie. >> Today probably not a very big 14:39:32 deal because we are a small group, but next week whenever -- I 14:39:35 think the protocol is whenever someone is going to 14:39:38 speak, to get them -- to begin 14:39:41 with an introduction. >> Yeah. 14:39:46 Yeah. >> We need to get more in the habit 14:39:49 of doing that. Little inserts between 14:39:53 some statements -- those will kind of slip through, but if you are 14:39:57 say giving a thing about a project or something like that or 14:40:00 launching into a question, it would be good to lead with, you 14:40:06 know, this is planner Tim Heron. >> So Julie, I also think we 14:40:09 need 14:40:12 something to draw your attention to the fact that we have a 14:40:15 question. How do we do 14:40:19 that without jumping and interrupting somebody else. >> Yeah, I think we 14:40:22 will want to make really good use of 14:40:25 the participants' 14:40:29 list. If your mouse is live at the bottom of your 14:40:32 zoom window, your zoom frame, there should 14:40:35 be a little icon of participants. Mine looks 14:40:40 like two people, and it has a number 14:40:43 "17" next to it because there are 17 people participating. If you click on 14:40:46 that, you get a really useful panel along the 14:40:49 right side of the zoom 14:40:53 window. That is a shortcut to know whose mic is on, whose video 14:40:57 is on. There is also, I think, an opportunity to 14:41:00 raise hands here. Is that 14:41:04 enabled on our current zoom? >> It is. >> Commissioner Jessica just 14:41:07 raised her hand. It comes up on the screen. There you go. >> 14:41:10 And Jessica, will you tell us how you raised your 14:41:14 hand, and we can all practice? >> Once you have 14:41:17 the participant panel open at the very bottom, there is 14:41:20 a raise and lower hand button. There are three 14:41:23 buttons, invite, mute, and raise hand. >> I don't have 14:41:27 that. >> I don't have that, either. >> Go to the 14:41:31 ellipses. There is an ellipses, which should be the 14:41:34 bottom right -- >> The little dots. Yes. 14:41:37 Okay. Raise hand. Got 14:41:40 it. >> There is little dots some place? >> It's like a little box with 14:41:43 three dots on the very right hand. >> Oh, yeah, 14:41:46 yeah. I have got it. Okay. 14:41:50 Good. That's a good one. >> That's 14:41:54 great. >> I don't see that. I see participants, 14:41:57 17, share screen. >> 14:42:00 Click that first. >> Yep. >> Click 14:42:04 participants. >> Okay. >> I still see two 14:42:07 people and 17. >> But you should have had a window pop 14:42:10 -- you might have popups 14:42:13 blocked. You should have had a window pop up that 14:42:16 has the participants. >> Okay. It has a 14:42:19 list of all the participants, but -- >> That's it. >> Go to 14:42:22 the very bottom, Don. There is 14:42:26 a box with three DOS on 14:42:29 -- three dots on the right-hand side of the 14:42:32 bottom. >> Let's see, I see Rachelle -- 14:42:35 >> Farther down. >> I see it says, 14:42:38 raise hand. >> That's it. >> 14:42:43 Yeah. >> Your hand is raised. >> Boom! You did it. [Laughter] 14:42:47 >> Meeting adjourned. [Laughter] >> Fantastic. >> I have another question, 14:42:53 though, these are people in the Webinar, correct? 14:42:57 So that -- 14:43:00 grace, 14:43:04 Hillary, we are attending like someone would attend in the audience? >> The next 14:43:07 move right now would be Julia is going to 14:43:10 ask if any of them wanted to testify and what 14:43:13 Laura and -- or Bryan were going to do, once we see a show 14:43:16 of hands, would be to promote them if you will from 14:43:20 attendee to panelist, and at that point, if they wanted to share their video they 14:43:24 could. If they were testifying. >> Let's go through that. Yeah. >> 14:43:27 If they don't that's fine. They can simply 14:43:31 speak. When the invite goes to attendees, 14:43:34 basically they are invited to speak. They don't have 14:43:37 to. What will happen is the premise will go to them and 14:43:40 say you are invited to speak, and then they need to select whether or not 14:43:43 they turn their microphone on or 14:43:48 off. I am not sure which testifier that was. 14:43:51 [Laughter] [ dog barking] >> Whose dog 14:43:54 was that? >> So I guess 14:43:57 Julia, this could be a good time. I happened to reach 14:44:00 out to [inaudible]. I know that she would be available to at 14:44:03 least speak maybe or may not with the video, but I 14:44:07 guess I would open it up to you 14:44:09 to ask if there is any attend 14:44:15 ees that would like to testify. And let's go from there. >> There are four 14:44:20 attendees in our hearing today, and I would like 14:44:22 to invite any or all of the attendees to 14:44:26 raise their hand through the participants list 14:44:29 and tell us that you would like to provide some 14:44:33 public testimony, or at least help us test drive 14:44:36 public testimony. We want to be sure the systems 14:44:42 are working. >> Shy people. >> 14:44:45 Well, I think there might be a moment, 14:44:48 too, where -- frankly, this is an issue where it's part of 14:44:51 zoom fatigue where you don't have that more immediate 14:44:55 human connection. So sometimes it makes -- it may take 14:44:58 time for someone to raise or not, and we don't necessarily always 14:45:01 know if someone is actively 14:45:04 listening or participating. >> Okay. >> All right, 14:45:07 Lee and Hillary have both raised their 14:45:10 hands. I am 14:45:14 going to -- >> And you have control, too, 14:45:17 Julia, if you want to, or you can ask 14:45:21 Laura. >> There is Grace Jeffreys's hand. 14:45:24 Laura, would you like me to promote or would you like to promote? >> You 14:45:27 know, either way. It seems pretty smooth you 14:45:30 doing it because you are also introducing 14:45:34 them at the same time, but either way. You just let us know in 14:45:38 each hearing. >> Right on. I am happy to do it. So I am going 14:45:41 to invite Lee 14:45:45 Algood in first for two minutes of trial and error public testimony 14:45:49 followed by 14:45:52 Hillary Adams followed by Grace Jeffreys. Thanks for being willing to 14:45:55 be Guinea pigs. Here we go with promoting Lee to 14:45:58 a panelist. 14:46:05 Okay. >> Can you hear me? >> Yes. Very 14:46:09 nice. >> It's good to see you all, and this has been really interesting to watch. I 14:46:12 am really impressed that staff has you all up and running 14:46:15 so smoothly, so quickly. 14:46:18 So just -- do you want to hear feedback about 14:46:21 the observers side? >> We 14:46:27 do. >> Please. >> So what happens when you promoted me to panelist is 14:46:31 that everything disappears and I rejoined so there was a moment where I 14:46:34 am not in the meeting. There will be 14:46:38 a pause as someone is transitioning over. 14:46:42 Also, I was emailing with Tim that at a certain point 14:46:45 when you were calling for testimony 14:46:48 my hand 14:46:52 disappeared. It reappeared, and I raised it, but initially I was 14:46:55 not able to do that. That's what happened 14:46:58 there. And I will be seeing you all again next week, so that's why I 14:47:01 am here observing how this 14:47:05 works. >> Thanks for being willing to do this 14:47:08 today. We will be very patient with the 14:47:12 transition from attendees to panelists and moving 14:47:15 between, how moving between rooms works. >> Thank 14:47:19 you. >> Julie, just an observation that maybe someone can comment 14:47:22 on before when I saw 14:47:25 Li in the list of attendees, it said 14:47:28 "talking permitted" in parenthesis, but she had 14:47:32 not been transferred or changed into a 14:47:35 panelist, so is there another way that someone can participate without 14:47:38 you having to transfer between attendee and 14:47:41 participant? Does anyone know how that's working? >> Yeah, 14:47:44 actually, we discussed not moving 14:47:47 the attendees to panelist unless they had something 14:47:50 to 14:47:54 share. When she was named, I went in and allowed her 14:47:58 to speak, so you saw that happen, and then Julie 14:48:02 turned her attendee to panelist, so that's what you saw 14:48:05 happen. >> So we -- I tripped over you, 14:48:08 Laura. You were out in front there 14:48:11 making the transition, and I just did something that did not need to be 14:48:15 done. >> Oh, no. That's something that we are still 14:48:18 discussing. Do we want to make them panelists every time, or do we 14:48:21 want to keep them in the attendee mode to 14:48:24 speak? They still can speak, but 14:48:27 the first step would be allow them once we named them. >> 14:48:33 Okay. They can be seen? >> Say that again, 14:48:36 Sam? >> They have to be panelists to be seen? >> 14:48:40 Yes. >> So if they are in the waiting -- I mean in the 14:48:43 other room and can speak, you can make them do that -- you don't see 14:48:46 them unless you make them panelists. >> 14:48:50 Correct. >> It's a zoom permission setting. >> I am not sure about 14:48:55 that. Hillary, I made you to be able to speak. Let's see if 14:48:58 we see you. >> Yes. I can 14:49:01 speak. >> So we see her name. >> I think 14:49:04 you meant video, Sam. >> Can 14:49:07 you throw on our 14:49:10 video, Hillary? >> I don't have that option. >> Let's make you a 14:49:14 panelist. >> Sure. >> We are going to pop you to panelist and 14:49:18 see what -- have you go to video. >> Who 14:49:21 does that? >> Laura, Julie or 14:49:24 I. Basically the hosts or co-hosts or 14:49:27 Bryan. That's the upper tier, if you 14:49:32 will, of the permission settings. >> Hey. >> 14:49:35 Hi. >> So Sam and Julie, this is something which we 14:49:38 specifically discussed. I think originally 14:49:42 rolling into this we didn't appreciate the 14:49:45 experience of an attendee versus a panelist. A 14:49:48 panelist generally is a broad experience. 14:49:51 You can see the video or the screen. 14:49:54 The attendees, it feels like you 14:49:57 have blinders on. It's a different experience from the public's 14:50:01 perspective, and we are struggling with that, I think. 14:50:04 So what we've decided, at least moving 14:50:07 forward, is giving people the option to share their video if they want 14:50:10 to, but the only way that we can do that is if we promote 14:50:13 them out from the attendee box and into the 14:50:16 panelist box. 14:50:20 Part of the -- just the meeting 14:50:23 gymnastics there, at least on Laura and Bryan's 14:50:26 part, is having too many panelists to manage, sort, 14:50:29 and invite and participate. There is a bit of a 14:50:33 sorting factor. I think we are going to try it out and see how it 14:50:39 goes. >> We could, before someone is promoted from attendee to 14:50:42 panelist, we could just ask them, right, give them the opportunity 14:50:46 to speak and say, would you like us to move you to video? >> That 14:50:48 could be just a protocol we build in. Yep. 14:50:51 Okay. Noted. >> I have a quick question, 14:50:55 if you move over to video, you can share your 14:50:57 screen, too. >> Correct. >> 14:51:01 Yes. >> I could see how that would be good and 14:51:04 bad. >> Yeah. >> So we 14:51:07 will figure it out. I think that we will practice. This was 14:51:10 good. Thank you, Li, for offering 14:51:14 that. Here's Hillary, do you ever something to say? >> 14:51:17 I 14:51:20 do. I agree with Li, my little hand 14:51:24 went away. That's why you did not get responses right 14:51:27 away, probably. >> What was 14:51:31 that? >> I am not sure why that happened. We had the ability 14:51:34 earlier on, and then when I got ready for you all to 14:51:37 speak, I looked and it was gone. I am not sure 14:51:40 if someone accidentally hit it who is also a 14:51:44 co-host. It's weird it went away. >> Yeah. >> It came back. >> 14:51:48 Okay. >> That's because I had to put it back on. >> The other 14:51:52 interesting thing about being an attendee versus a 14:51:56 panelist, you can't see who else is in the room. You have no idea how many people 14:52:00 are there. Sometimes when you 14:52:03 are providing testimony on a 14:52:06 case, you are supported by a room full of people who feel the 14:52:09 same way, and you would not necessarily know that you have that or 14:52:13 don't have that. >> Right. >> In this forum. >> That's 14:52:17 all. I just wanted to say hi. >> Very nice to 14:52:20 see you, Hillary. >> That's 14:52:23 really good. I think that -- I know 14:52:26 -- I saw Kara had a few emails 14:52:30 today with Darren earlier just asking about 14:52:33 that because Megan walker, one of our planners, mentioned 14:52:36 that, as 14:52:39 well and. I am not a tech person 14:52:42 but I don't see why zoom can't have a patch that allows 14:52:45 attendees to see everyone in the room so you have a sense of 14:52:51 the room before you go into the room. Even though you are 14:52:54 listening the whole time. I heard Kara asked some 14:52:57 really good questions of paper, and he 14:53:00 kept coming back hard with maybe we don't have that option, but 14:53:03 maybe we kick it up a notch. Kara? >> 14:53:07 Yeah. This is a great conversation because we are 14:53:11 struggling with it and staff wanting to be, you 14:53:14 know, transparent and provide a comfortable space for people. I am 14:53:17 wondering if Julie or 14:53:21 Laura, you know, when we start testimony or something to announce like 14:53:25 okay, there is X amount of people in 14:53:28 the room or could we do a screen share, or something to say this is what 14:53:32 it looks like at this moment, and a bunch of people will talk. I don't know. 14:53:37 Just something as a bandaid. >> You can't screen share 14:53:40 a zoom, though. >> You can't? Okay. All right. All 14:53:46 right. >> Maybe it's an announcement at the beginning of testimony, 14:53:48 and then maybe if it's a long list, you 14:53:51 know, during the middle of testimony or 14:53:54 something to give a sense of what's going on out 14:53:59 there. >> Yes. >> Julie? 14:54:02 This is 14:54:07 Zari. Often during hearings and when people come 14:54:10 and testify, they bring with 14:54:14 them materials with them. How do we get 14:54:17 a chance to read 14:54:20 those if they do come and submit something? 14:54:23 Do we -- is this 14:54:26 -- are they required to submit their written stuff in advance so we 14:54:29 would have access to them? How would that 14:54:34 work? >> Yeah. My guess is everything 14:54:37 has to be submitted to the 14:54:42 planner. >> Julie, but if they have -- so the moment that they are 14:54:45 making their presentation, they are made a panelist, they 14:54:48 can share their screens and show us their 14:54:51 -- whatever photos, sometimes, you know, sometimes they come to the 14:54:56 meeting with that information, and they can share it at that point. You can 14:54:59 always cut them 14:55:03 off. >> There would be two or three-minute limits, 14:55:06 as there usually are. >> So there is a 14:55:09 way to show -- I just 14:55:12 e-mailed this to Laura and Tim and maybe 14:55:15 Kara. There is a way, if you are the organizer, so show 14:55:18 the number of participants for the 14:55:21 attendees. So in your participants' window at 14:55:25 the bottom it should say "mute 14:55:28 all, and unmute all, and more." In there you have 14:55:31 options to allow attendees to view the 14:55:37 participants. >> Say that again? >> You know what, I will just send you 14:55:40 the link. >> And I see what you are talking about, 14:55:45 yeah. I allowed it, so 14:55:48 let's see -- >> There is only one attendee 14:55:52 left. >> Jacob is in there. >> 14:55:57 Yeah. >> Hello. >> Hello. >> Hi, 14:56:00 Jacob. >> 14:56:05 Hi. >> I am Jacob lobe, I've been 14:56:09 observing. I write a news blog, and I usually listen to 14:56:12 your audio recordings 14:56:15 online to get a background about the trends in 14:56:18 the building area and really the 14:56:22 forward-looking ideas for the city. >> 14:56:25 Welcome. Thanks for joining us. >> Thank you. >> Now 14:56:28 Jacob, cuz how many 14:56:31 , can you see how many people are attending? >> I am looking around. I am not seeing 14:56:34 that 14:56:38 offhand. >> At the bottom of your zoom window there should be 14:56:42 a participants. >> What's interesting, though, is 14:56:45 that -- never mind. Sorry. I am 14:56:52 sorry. >> That's good. Do you have 14:56:56 that? >> We were testing to see, as an attendee, he could 14:56:59 see the fact I allowed him to see how many people were 14:57:02 in attendance, what we were just talking 14:57:05 about. >> Got it. >> But it does not sound like he could see 14:57:09 it. >> I couldn't see it. I am in a panelist 14:57:12 view now, so I am trying to 14:57:17 see. Actually, I do see it 14:57:20 now. I see the participant 17, but that was 14:57:23 invisible to me when I was -- >> 14:57:27 Okay. >> Yeah. I think we are going to make some phone calls 14:57:30 to zoom and change some things. [Laughter] >> We 14:57:33 will have it ready for next hearing, next week. Don't 14:57:38 worry. >> Thank you, Jacob. >> That said, 14:57:43 Julie, you could at some point, right, say 14:57:47 attendees -- these are all the attendees, maybe at the 14:57:50 beginning or when public testimony starts 14:57:54 and show this to 14:57:57 everybody as a shared 14:58:01 screen. >> Yes. Yes. We should maybe have a bit of 14:58:03 -- before next Thursday's hearing, 14:58:07 have some conversation about how we do want 14:58:10 to manage attendees and 14:58:13 written testimony versus screen share. We 14:58:17 should follow a well 14:58:20 thought-out rule from day one. >> Yeah. 14:58:28 Yep. >> I 14:58:31 provide the testimony list or the, you 14:58:34 know, registration list like I showed you in the example 14:58:37 today, a few of you. >> Yeah. >> The problem is it's 14:58:40 r resolve revolving. People 14:58:43 can attend and declare they want to be added onto 14:58:47 it, so how do I get that to you during the course of the hearing. That's 14:58:50 the difficult part. That's what we need to brainstorm. >> Yeah. So Laura 14:58:53 is going to get the attendees showing 14:58:56 up after 1:30, you 14:58:59 know, or at the estimated time that we put down on 14:59:02 the agenda for when the item will start, and that's when names start 14:59:05 to show up. We are encouraging 14:59:09 people to register early so that we could kind of 14:59:12 manage that queue and Laura can get named 14:59:17 queued up correctly. >> It seems like at some 14:59:21 point from the start of the hearing 14:59:26 through the staff presentation and the applicant presentation, at some 14:59:29 point maybe towards the end of that series of 14:59:34 presentations, maybe Laura needs to come in and 14:59:37 highlight a check-in with all of the commissioners 14:59:40 to help us to kind of figure 14:59:44 out how many testifiers that we will scroll through and 14:59:47 verify that everybody who wants to testify or provide 14:59:51 commentary has raised their hand and provide a bit 14:59:54 of verbal instruction in real 15:00:00 time. >> One of the things you will see, and we will sort this out, 15:00:04 but when people register for the 21st, 15:00:07 the prompt is what are you testifying for. So it's 15:00:11 not like, I am coming to the hearing. Someone, obviously, 15:00:15 could. Jacob, it sounds like, you are going to be a regular 15:00:18 attendee every Thursday, which is 15:00:23 fantastic. But I think hopefully what we will 15:00:26 see -- and this is something that Laura and Bryan will do, 15:00:29 and we will sort through once we get these hearings better 15:00:32 under our belt 15:00:36 -- you will see the Mr. Testifier, item one 15:00:39 and two. Something like 15:00:42 that there is some kind of enumeration within the 15:00:45 hearing that they are, and that will help us sort it. Either 15:00:48 way, Julie, just like you do, and again I channel the 15:00:51 hearing room, is when you look out, if no one is in the 15:00:56 room, no one is testifying. What the trick on 15:00:59 this one is, you see some names. We may not know if they want to testify or 15:01:02 not, so I think that we are still going to ask the question out 15:01:05 loud verbally. Is there films here to testify on 15:01:08 item number one? I see some people for two, but I want to 15:01:11 make sure that that's correct, and we rely on the raised 15:01:15 hand thing. >> Yes. >> Laura, 15:01:18 does that sound -- am I getting that right? >> I think that's the 15:01:21 easiest. I think that's how we should try 15:01:24 next week and see how it works and work out the bugs after next week. >> Let 15:01:27 me ask a question, though, because the 15:01:32 people, the attendees can actually raise their hand, 15:01:36 right? >> Yes. >> Right. >> Would it make 15:01:39 sense there then that 15:01:42 just like Julie or I or whoever 15:01:45 is sharing the meeting 15:01:48 do, after the presentation from 15:01:51 staff, come to -- comes the presentation 15:01:56 from the applicant that wraps it 15:01:59 up. At that point, should Julie or 15:02:02 whoever is doing the meeting ask of the attendees, can we 15:02:06 see a raise of hands of who is going to testify? >> 15:02:12 Yes. In order to keep confusion down, though, for 15:02:15 attendees, I am going to keep the ability of them being able to raise their 15:02:18 hands off until testifying 15:02:22 begins. We have chat off, and even if they raise their hands prior, I 15:02:25 am not going to be able to communicate with them to find out what 15:02:31 they're questioning or if it has something to do with 15:02:34 testifying. So at testimony, I will then allow that 15:02:37 ability for the raised hand function. We 15:02:41 will go through the first numbered once that said in 15:02:44 registration they were intending to testify, and then Julie would prompt 15:02:47 them and say, are there any 15:02:51 other interested attendees interested in testifying? And at that point, we 15:02:54 will watch for raised 15:02:57 hands. >> Okay. >> Could we -- I guess you 15:03:00 will have them in line, but could 15:03:03 we just prefix their names with testifying or something 15:03:06 like that? >> What I am going to do 15:03:09 -- the agenda items are labeled one, two, three, four. One 15:03:12 is always items of interest. Number two, number 15:03:20 2-t for testifier, one, two, and three, and testifiers for 15:03:23 agenda item number 3, which would be the 15:03:26 third piece in the hearing, they will 15:03:29 be 15:03:32 number two, dash, t one, two, and 15:03:36 tree, and that's the only way I can organize them. >> Laura, you are 15:03:39 amazing. 15:03:42 Brilliant. >> What have you missed? >> I know. [Laughter] >> 15:03:45 I think that -- yeah. Thanks, Laura. Again that 15:03:49 goes back to there is a lot -- there is a bunch of 15:03:54 gymnastics Laura is dealing with before these hearings. Thank 15:03:57 you, Laura. >> Yeah. We will run with it and see how it 15:04:02 works. See how they feel about it. >> 15:04:07 Okay. >> Madam chair, I have to leave in about five minutes. >> I 15:04:11 think this we are just about wrapped up, folks. >> Does 15:04:14 -- so Hillary offered to 15:04:17 do the first ever 15:04:20 screen shot zoom 15:04:24 commission hearing 15:04:27 ensemble. Jacob, you are welcome to stay but this is going to go on the public 15:04:31 documents, and this is going to go to the city council. >> I can 15:04:35 drop out and give you Honors here. >> Thank you for 15:04:38 coming, Jacob. >> Thank you. >> Hey, Jess, can you get 15:04:42 closer to your camera? >> 15:04:45 Yeah. It's kind of hard. >> And up a bit. There you go. >>> >> There. 15:04:48 Okay. >> Hillary, are 15:04:51 you available? >> Yes, I am. >> Who else wants 15:04:54 to show their 15:04:59 smile? >> Do you want to take 15:05:02 Jacob off the -- >> 15:05:06 Yes. >> He's going to go into, you know, city council 15:05:09 and stuff like that, so -- >> You scared 15:05:12 him off. >> Thank you, 15:05:16 Jacob. >> This is g 15:05:22 Grace. >> Yes,. >> Move 15:05:28 Yes -- >> I can't see how I can get rid of 15:05:31 myself. [Laughter] >> You know you guys, if you go to 15:05:35 the little camera in your zoom in the 15:05:38 lower task bar, if you click on video settings there is an option to 15:05:41 only see people with video so that you don't 15:05:44 -- all the blank squares with names, 15:05:47 those don't pop up, and that way you can see the people bigger and 15:05:50 the squares are not so tiny. >> Thank 15:05:54 you. >> I am online, and I see that Hillary has a 15:05:57 bunch of photographs. >> Yes. >> 15:06:00 Okay. >> You might want to have yours changed, 15:06:05 Julie. >> She did not let us know that she was doing 15:06:10 that. [Laughter] >> It was a surprise attack, 15:06:14 yes. [Laughter] >> I will click when you see 15:06:20 it. >> Okay. >> Well, 15:06:24 commissioners, it's great. Let's -- on the three 15:06:27 counts, say cheese. One, two, 15:06:30 three. >> Cheese. >> 15:06:34 Cheese. >> Okay, got it. >> Thank you, Hillary. >> 15:06:37 Thank you. >> 15:06:41 Okay. >> Julie, fantastic. Good job. >> Yeah, good 15:06:44 job. >> Everyone, good job. >> Thanks to everyone 15:06:47 for doing the test drive here, this is really 15:06:53 helpful